From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 21:02:24 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: COZY: Composit Construction practice kit. On 01/18/99 20:14:12 you wrote: > >Hi Glenn, > Good luck buddy. I hope you feel secure while you are doing it and >really have a sense of accomplishment when you are finished. Hey, I bet >we all felt about like you do right about now. Let us know how you make >out. >Gary Dwinal > >Glenn Hobbs wrote: > >> Just received my composit construction practice kit from aircraft >> spruce. Will soon know if I'm cut out for composit construction. > > > > > Building an EZ is a series of small steps, stating with easy pieces, getting more complicated as it goes along. Workmanship and expertice is learned as you go along. Thats not the difficult part. The hard part including everyone around you is the time commitment. It took me 4200 hours in 3.5 years. Thats 4200 hours that your wife or girlfriend has either help, support or find something else to do. My wife helped only a little, but supported by bringing a hot or iced tea, waiting for the UPS delivery, go to town and get supplies. Their have been more than a few divorces as a result of a project, in my book thats not worth it. Good luck!!! Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 23:21:05 -0600 From: James Russell Subject: COZY: RE: Workshops Hi: I went to a builders workshop in Denton, TX a couple of years ago. Jeff Russell and his wife taught the wet lay-up section. I have been working in composites since 1990 and still learned allot. Being around other builders helps as you can trade info, make friends, and just get connected. If you are starting in composites, I would really recommend a workshop to fill in your knowledge gaps, build confidence in the materials, and validate your skills. My class was Sat.-Sun..: Sat we cut a canard core and laid up the shear web and spar caps. Sun. we skinned half the lower surface. All in all, the class was money well spent! In general, composites are much more forgiving than sheet metal but you still must respect the materials as gravity always wins. High quality parts are always lighter, stronger, and give you a fantastic feeling of a job well done. I picked a Cozy because composites gives you large parts quickly (which helps me stay motivated), no corrosion, ease of repair/mods, nominal 4 seats (or 2 place w/ lots of bags/fuel), 20+ years of home built successes, and a very helpful user group! Thanks, James Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 20:55:41 -0600 From: John Hucker Subject: COZY: Sportair Builders Conference I recently attended the EAA / Sportair Builders conference in Oshkosh. Two days immersed in the art of airplane construction! There were 2 day seminars for composite construction, fabric covering, electronics and also a 2 day conference of assorted topics. I was surprised to find my composite instructor was none other than Jeff Russell! Having only heard of him through this Cozy builders group, I was not sure what to expect. He was a very good instructor and shared his composite construction knowledge with the group. I have to say that I was impressed with both the course and the instructor! I highly recommend these courses to future and even current builders, what a resource to draw from. Thanks Jeff, I learned a lot! From: "John Slade" Subject: COZY: Which plane to build? Date: Wed, 3 Feb 1999 12:08:21 -0500 Hello Canard builders. I plan to join your distinguished group in the next few weeks. The question is - which one? I've narrowed it down to the Cozy IV the AeroCanard FG/RG (Aero) and the AeroCanard SB (which seems to be a kit Cozy). I rejected the Velocity based on price, single stick and performance. I know this is primarily a "builders" forum, but I'd really appreciate input from anyone listening, biased or not. The issues as I see them are: 1. Support. This is probably the biggest issue. How do the plans / manuals compare? Given the size of this group, and the responsiveness I've already received from Nat I suspect I'll get better email and voice support if I'm working on a Cozy. Discussion? 2. Size. The Aero is a little wider at the top. Aero even say that the SB/Cozy back seat is for children. Can two full sized adults ride in comfort in the back of a cozy, or does that 4 inches make all the difference? 3. Cockpit heat. Aero uses nose oil cooler. Cozy uses exhaust muff. Any big deal either way? 4. Speed brake. Aero is electric, Cozy is manual. But I can fit an electric in a Cozy - right? 5. Wheels / braking. Aero is a little bigger on wheels. 600-6 cf 500-5. Are the Cozy wheels too small? 6. Useful load. Cozy claims 1000lb. Aero lists Cozy at 900 and themselves at 950. Who is right? This is important to me since I want to occasionally fly with 2 couples and I want the range. 7. Fuel system. Aero has a sump. Cozy a selector. I'm used to switching in a Cherokee, so this doesnt seem a big deal. In fact I prefer it. This way I can KNOW I have fuel in the other tank. Discussion? 8. Seat type. I think Id prefer the Cozy buckets rather than the aero bench. Are these interchangeable? 9. Build time. I like building things and I'd kinda like to do it from scratch, but Aero says the cozy takes 2500+ while they claim 1400. I am, however, concerned with getting a high quality result. Are those precut cores etc. going to make that much difference in time and quality for the $9000 price difference? 10. RG. I can decide on RG later if I go with Aero. Cozy is fixed. 11. Width. I'm currently building my workshop for this project. How wide do the doors need to be to get the fixed parts of the plane out comfortably. i.e. wheel it out without the wings attached? 11 feet? 12. Location. Aero is moving to an airport just up the road from me. That might be very handy. 13. Any other differences I haven't considered but should? Lastly. I live in West Palm Beach, FL. I see that there are about 20 Cozy builder in this state, but I don't know how active they are. Are there any builders in Florida who wouldn't mind my visiting and picking their brains a little? Regard, and thanks in advance for any comments you might have. John Slade jslade@kgarden.com Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 13:29:07 -0500 From: Paul Krasa Subject: Re: COZY: Which plane to build? I am going to take a shot at this as an unbiased person (Long EZ builder). IMHO snip >I know this is primarily a "builders" forum, but I'd really appreciate input >from anyone listening, biased or not. The issues as I see them are: > >1. Support. This is probably the biggest issue. How do the plans / manuals >compare? Given the size of this group, and the responsiveness I've already >received from Nat I suspect I'll get better email and voice support if I'm >working on a Cozy. Discussion? Both are well done and as good as the industry gets. No, matter which you decide to build I would recommend buying the Cozy IV plans. If you do not build a cozy then they will be an excellent reference. > >2. Size. The Aero is a little wider at the top. Aero even say that the >SB/Cozy back seat is for children. Can two full sized adults ride in comfort >in the back of a cozy, or does that 4 inches make all the difference? Define full size. Two 200# adults, probably not. > >3. Cockpit heat. Aero uses nose oil cooler. Cozy uses exhaust muff. Any big >deal either way? Its a wash. If I was building either one, I would do the nose oil cooler with the VW fan as described in Central States and Kitplanes last summer. > >4. Speed brake. Aero is electric, Cozy is manual. But I can fit an electric >in a Cozy - right? The manual and the electric both work. > >5. Wheels / braking. Aero is a little bigger on wheels. 600-6 cf 500-5. Are >the Cozy wheels too small? You can put what ever wheels you prefer. > >6. Useful load. Cozy claims 1000lb. Aero lists Cozy at 900 and themselves >at 950. Who is right? This is important to me since I want to occasionally fly with 2 couples and >I want the range. You are the manufacturer, so it all depends. If you load up the avionics, and put in a large engine, the useful load goes down. Alot will have to do with your building technique. If you pay alot of attention to keeping your layups light, then the fuselage will be light. > >7. Fuel system. Aero has a sump. Cozy a selector. I'm used to switching in a >Cherokee, so this doesnt seem a big deal. In fact I prefer it. This way I >can KNOW I have fuel in the other tank. Discussion? You can do the Cozy with a sump. No big deal. > >8. Seat type. I think Id prefer the Cozy buckets rather than the aero bench. >Are these interchangeable? build it the way you prefer. > >9. Build time. I like building things and I'd kinda like to do it from >scratch, but Aero says the cozy takes 2500+ while they claim 1400. I am, >however, concerned with getting a high quality result. Are those precut >cores etc. going to make that much difference in time and quality for the >$9000 price difference? Precut cores are nice but not essential. The big time savings is in the molded parts. To a point you are mixing apples and oranges. The AeroCanard is built from a Kit, and the Cozy is built from plans. The trade off is time for money. This is a personal decision. Either process will produce a high quality airplane, but the final product is builder dependent. >10. RG. I can decide on RG later if I go with Aero. Cozy is fixed. Don't waste your time. Any retractable system is heavier, and thus takes away from useful load, and the difference in speed is only a few knots. >11. Width. I'm currently building my workshop for this project. How wide do >the doors need to be to get the fixed parts of the plane out comfortably. >i.e. wheel it out without the wings attached? 11 feet? A large two car garage door is the minumum. The fuselage with the spar attached will not go through a single garage door. > >12. Location. Aero is moving to an airport just up the road from me. That >might be very handy. yep > >13. Any other differences I haven't considered but should? Your size and your significant others. both the Aero Canard and the cozy have wieght limits to the front seat. It will be cramped if either person is large. > >Lastly. I live in West Palm Beach, FL. I see that there are about 20 Cozy >builder in this state, but I don't know how active they are. Are there any >builders in Florida who wouldn't mind my visiting and picking their brains a >little? go to a EAA Chapter 724 meeting. Many canard builders there. MHO Paul Long EZ 214LP Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 22:46:52 -0500 From: "Marc J. Zeitlin" Subject: Fwd: COZY: Which plane to build? John Slade asks; >1. Support. This is probably the biggest issue. How do the plans / manuals >compare? Unless Jeff has recently updated his instructions in a substantive manner, you will end up taking copious notes from his videotapes to go along with the plans he sends. This one goes to the COZY. >.... Given the size of this group, and the responsiveness I've already >received from Nat I suspect I'll get better email and voice support if I'm >working on a Cozy. Discussion? Many of the builders on this forum are building COZY/Aerocanard mixtures, or have used some AC parts in their COZY's, or are building AC's. This one's a wash. >2. Size. ...... Can two full sized adults ride in comfort >in the back of a cozy, or does that 4 inches make all the difference? No. I'm 5'6", and it's pretty cramped back there. I could sit there for a couple of hours, but after that, I'd be pretty uncomfortable. The 4" would help, but the big issue is leg room, not necessarily width. Unless the rear seat passengers are short, they won't be happy. Advantage, AC, but not much. >4. Speed brake. Aero is electric, Cozy is manual. But I can fit an electric >in a Cozy - right? Yes. An approved one from Wayne Lanza, no less. >5. Wheels / braking. Aero is a little bigger on wheels. 600-6 cf 500-5. Are >the Cozy wheels too small? No, they're not too small. The larger wheels will give you better rough field performance, but the small wheels have less drag. Depends what's important to you - the COZY/AC isn't really a rough field plane in any case. WRT brakes, read the archives/FAQ. >6. Useful load. Cozy claims 1000lb. Aero lists Cozy at 900 and themselves >at 950. Who is right? >This is important to me since I want to occasionally fly with 2 couples and >I want the range. Everyone's right. You're the builder, you can set the gross weight at anything you want. Nat's plane was about 1050 lbs. empty, and the gross was 2050 lbs. If you build yours heavier but set the gross weight the same, you'll have less useful load. Conversely, if you magically build a 950 lb COZY, you'll have 100 lbs more useful load. Now, you can set your gross weight to 2300 lbs if you want, but unless you're an aerodynamic/structural engineer, I wouldn't recommend using anything other than the weight determined by Nat. Four 170 lb (standard) people is 680 lbs - 52 gal. of fuel is about 320 lbs - by golly, that's 1000 lbs :-). Remember, that's anywhere from 5 - 7 hours in the air - do you really need full fuel? Will your passengers be ready to kill you? :-). >7. Fuel system. Aero has a sump. Cozy a selector..... Discussion? Read the archives/FAQ. This is a religious issue. >8. Seat type. I think Id prefer the Cozy buckets rather than the aero bench. >Are these interchangeable? You can certainly build either either way. >9. Build time. ...... Are those precut >cores etc. going to make that much difference in time and quality for the >$9000 price difference? >10. RG. I can decide on RG later if I go with Aero. Cozy is fixed. Same with COZY. The Infinity gear used on both is retrofittable. >11. Width. I'm currently building my workshop for this project. How wide do >the doors need to be to get the fixed parts of the plane out comfortably. >i.e. wheel it out without the wings attached? 11 feet? The spar is almost 12 ft. - I calculated that you can get it out a 11' door with the wings off. -- Marc J. Zeitlin marcz@ultranet.com http://www.ultranet.com/~marcz/ Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 17:47:25 -0500 From: Gary Dwinal Subject: Re: Fwd: COZY: Which plane to build? As for the size of the door in your shop. I have two ten foot doors on my shop and have taken my completed fuselage out and in a couple of times. It is very tight but it can be done. Gary Dwinal - AeroCanard From ???@??? Thu Feb 04 20:06:41 1999 Return-Path: owner-cozy_builders@betaweb.com Received: from twc2.betaweb.com (majordomo@betaweb.com [206.43.209.18]) by acestes-fe0.ultra.net (8.8.8/ult/n20340/mtc.v2) with ESMTP id JAA28431 for ; Thu, 4 Feb 1999 09:07:49 -0500 (EST) Received: (from majordomo@localhost) by twc2.betaweb.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA03847 for cozy_builders-list; Thu, 4 Feb 1999 09:08:34 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: twc2.betaweb.com: majordomo set sender to owner-cozy_builders@betaweb.com using -f Received: from urth.netco.com (new-urth.netco.com [206.103.221.15]) by twc2.betaweb.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA03842 for ; Thu, 4 Feb 1999 09:08:29 -0500 Received: from dm.wamnet.com([192.168.168.2]) (1895 bytes) by urth.netco.com via sendmail with P:esmtp/R:inet_hosts/T:smtp (sender: ) id for ; Thu, 4 Feb 1999 08:01:39 -0600 (CST) (Smail-3.2.0.104 1998-Nov-20 #1 built 1998-Dec-7) Received: from cozy.wamnet.com(really [192.168.250.75]) by dm.wamnet.com via sendmail with esmtp id for <@mail-relay.wamnet.com:cozy_builders@canard.com>; Thu, 4 Feb 1999 08:01:38 -0600 (CST) (Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #3 built 1996-Nov-12) Received: (from tgb@localhost) by cozy.wamnet.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) id IAA03144; Thu, 4 Feb 1999 08:01:38 -0600 Date: Thu, 4 Feb 1999 08:01:38 -0600 Message-Id: <199902041401.IAA03144@cozy.wamnet.com> From: Tom Brusehaver To: EGStrong@aol.com CC: cozy_builders@canard.com In-reply-to: <1a6ac600.36b90c7f@aol.com> (EGStrong@aol.com) Subject: Re: Fwd: COZY: Fw: Virus Alert References: <1a6ac600.36b90c7f@aol.com> Sender: owner-cozy_builders@betaweb.com Precedence: bulk Reply-To: Tom Brusehaver X-UIDL: 21784a43f2562203122298d920cedef8 >On another note, I am still playing with the practice kit while working on >getting my pilot's license. (Thought it might be nice to learn how to fly >before I decided whether to build a plane). I have an ad for the Sportair >workshop. Have any of you been to one of these and did you think it was worth >it? I just finfished my bookend, and frankly, it could use a little >improvement... I went to the 2 day sportair workshop where they show'd you how to buck rivets, layup glass, fabric cover, and talked about motors. There were some really good hints about laying up glass, and how to buck rivets, that I really needed. I thought it was worth the money. The class is really for those who havn't decided what kind of kit to build, and gives you some hands on in the various types of material. Plus is offers suggestions on the right way to do it. The evening they also had people with various kits talk about their planes, and their building experience. Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 08:17:04 -0600 From: Ken Reiter Subject: COZY: Cozy flight aft of aft CG Hello Team, Just wanted to share some info with you about the CozyIII - thanks Nat. On a test flight, I had the opportunity to fly the plane close to gross with the cg .5" aft of the aft CG limit. I was following the FAA AC on testing new experimentals and by slowing moving the cg aft I was ready for the aft limit test. I AM NOT A TEST PILOT AND am sharing this info in the hope of helping others. Warning: If your craft pitches up dramatically on rotation - Please recheck you cg. This is the result in my plane with the cg aft of the 102 limit. It was like a spring shot the nose up when I rotated for take off; all other controls(feel) were the same as other flights. After the strong nose pitch-up, I tried nose down control and the nose started down - ok we have pitch control - so keep the speed building and be careful on pitch inputs. Since I had pitch control and speed, I elected to go around and setup for a fast final and touched down 20ks faster than usual. Everything went well and again thanks Nat for a safe design. Needless to say but the aft cg test are done! Good Luck and Keep building it is worth it, Ken Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 16:39:10 -0500 From: Jeff Russell Subject: Re: COZY: Cozy flight aft of aft CG Ken Reiter wrote: > Hello Team, > > I had the opportunity to fly the plane close to gross > with the cg .5" aft of the aft CG limit. > Warning: If your craft pitches up dramatically on rotation - Please recheck > you cg. This is the result in my plane with the cg aft of the 102 limit. What canard are you flying? GU or R1145MS. If R1145MS, How long? > It was like a spring shot the nose up when I rotated for take off; all > other controls(feel) were the same as other flights. After the strong nose > pitch-up, I tried nose down control and the nose started down - ok we have > pitch control - so keep the speed building and be careful on pitch inputs. Did you do any stall testing on the canard at this limit or did you just try to fly at those limits? Power off stalls or Power on stalls. I did not find this in your post. > Since I had pitch control and speed, I elected to go around and setup > for a fast final and touched down 20ks faster than usual. Everything went > well and again thanks Nat for a safe design. Needless to say but the aft cg > test are done! -- Jeff Russell/AeroCad Inc. Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 05:58:11 -0500 From: Jeff Russell Subject: COZY: Re: Cozy flight aft of aft CG > Ken Reiter wrote: > > > Hello Jeff - standard GU canard for CozyIII. > > > No stalls in this configuration - mainly due to possible main wing stall; > > however, aircraft was tested at aft cg and gross aft cg - no bad results. > > Thanks, it was not clear what you had done. > -- > Jeff From: Jim Hocut Subject: RE: COZY: COZY plans/templates for sale Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 22:34:32 -0500 > After few calls things were sorted > out, but I > still had to pay him $50 to be able to talk to Nat in the future. At least a satisfactory arrangement was worked out whereby Nat would offer builder support to a "second generation" plans purchaser. Burt has never given builder support in such cases, he has always insisted that the plans purchaser get a signed agreement from the person selling them to provide any needed builder support. Jim Hocut jhocut@mindspring.com From: "John Slade" Subject: COZY: "First Flight" Date: Fri, 5 Mar 1999 12:00:32 -0500 Thought the group might like to know.... I had my first flight in a canard today. Jeff Russel's AeroCanard FG. What a beautiful airplane. Flys like a dream. Very natural, very stable, very responsive. I flew there in a Cherokee. The contrast in stability (not to mention speed) was quite dramatic. Didn't want to get back in the Piper. One thought though - Jeff has quite a few mods on his plane which are not (yet?) Cz approved ... e.g. front oil cooler / heater, molded (i.e. straight) parts, bent canard, vernier throttle, larger main wheels, bench seat, side scoops, electric nose lift & speed brake, canopy design, larger fuel tanks, CD Player :), wider back seat, larger control surfaces etc. etc. Perhaps I speak for others when I say that I'm looking forward to seeing Nat's list of approvals and disapprovals after his visit with Jeff next month. I'd like to do some of these things on my plane, but not if I give up a safety factor (or my Cozy identification). The molded parts is a major one for me. The accuracy and finish on the molded parts is impressive. They’re ready to paint right out of the mold. I ’ve looked at quite a few homebuilts and every one is slightly different. Most have minor “wiggles” and bumps in the finish and I suspect that quite a bit of (heavy) filler was needed to get the finish they achieved. The moldless technique is the best for individual builders because it’s impractical for each builder to build a mold and use commercial techniques. They’re also much cheaper to make than buy. But, cost aside, now they’re available, molded parts seem a better bet. They may also be more structurally sound than anything my efforts could produce. While it's not Nat's resonsibility to venture opinion on every crazy idea a builder has, Jeff is a commercial approved supplier so I think different standards should apply. While its always safer to stick with what works, this is not how the experimental catagory came into being. We'd all be flying Wright specials. I'm in favor of careful, controlled evolution. I want to build the best airplane I can build and I'm not interested in anyone's internal politics. I hope that Nat will give us all a definitive list of which of AeroCad's innovations he thinks are safe, which are optional and which he feels are dangerous and why. Personally, I think it would be in all our best interests if what is now called the "AeroCanard" were renamed something like the Cozy XL after the strict specification for this airplane is agreed between the experts. OK. Back to the grind. F22 layup here I come.... John Slade (Cozy #757) From: "Ernesto Sanchez" Subject: Re: COZY: Hand Starting Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 15:23:04 -0800 >>The problem is that I have fitted Airflow Performance fuel injection, which is marvelous, and now for a hand start I need a second person to turn on the electric fuel pump when the engine starts. Does anyone know of a system which will turn on the electric pump automatically when the engine starts to run? >> How about an oil pressure switch closing a circuit at start-up? -----Original Message----- From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com To: EJCV@aol.com ; cozy_builders@canard.com Date: Tuesday, March 16, 1999 2:55 PM Subject: Re: COZY: Hand Starting >On 03/16/99 02:15:32 you wrote: >> >>My Long-Ez has a Conti. O-240 with a B&C starter. This starter was made for >>the O-200 which has 40% less capacity and, more importantly, significantly >>lower compression. The result is that the battery has to be fully charged to >>turn the engine. This is not a problem as, in any case, I prefer to hand swing >>the engine to start, especially from cold. >> >>Thanks, Eddie Vann. >> >> > >I have the Bendix injector, the Airflow should be the same, as someone else said, a brief >electric pump on with full rich when cold. When hot I start with idel cutoff, and richen the >mixture after it starts firing, that would for hand propping be a problem. Remember for an EZ >with updraft cooling, the distribution block should be mounted on the cold side (under or >forward of engine). Airflow can make the special length thin tubing. I have for sale a complete >set of IO-320 small tubing with clamps, etc. It was used 6 hours, then I went back to my >original cool side installation. > > From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 19:19:00 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: COZY: Hand Starting Was asked I think the response time would be too slow. Probably the real solution is fix the starter system so it can be used all the time. Much safer that way, plus some insurance policys exclude hand propping, and they go to extremes with that definition. From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 16:14:01 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: COZY: Experimental Airplane Sales Agreeement On 03/17/99 09:41:15 you wrote: > >A friend of mine is looking to buy a homebuilt aircraft, and the person >selling the plane is struggling with the wording for the sales agreement. I >have seen posted on the Internet a discussion and sample agreements for the >sale of experimental aircraft, but now that I want to find it, it eludes me. > >Does anyone know where this sample agreement can be found? > >Regards- >Norm Muzzy > > I think the EAA has a model agreement, call them. From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 20:13:17 -0600 (CST) Subject: COZY: Procedures As a result of a recent posting, Everyone building and flying should (MUST) have a current issue of the FAR's (or your government's equivalent) in particular "Appendix A to part 43" which defines Major repairs, alterations (changes), and preventive maintenance, and follow exactly as your operating limitations require. Also for Annual Inspections, make a copy from the EZ operator's manual of the requirements, AND "Appendix C to part 43" which defines specific items to be inspected. As you do the inspection, check off, I use a yellow felt tip pen. Retain these as proof that you did everything you are certifing. Note that there are a few items in the FAR's that are not in the Cosy list, and you are certifying to the FAR's, and the Cosy list has specific to the type items. Also other parts of the FAR's define how logbook entries should be made, and by who. When making entries one should always include with you name, certificate number, and type certificate (private pilot, repairman, or inspection). From: CHIPSLADE@aol.com Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 03:27:19 EST Subject: COZY: Cozy-? Purchasing 90% Complete Am going this afternoon to look at a "90%" complete canard aircraft..this one's a Vari-Eze. Any quick clues on first glance items to check or questions to ask? Am very serious about finding one to finish/fly. Thanks in advance for any replys/advice. Chip Slade Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 09:59:28 -0800 From: hrogers@slac.stanford.edu (Howard Rogers) Subject: Re: COZY: Cozy-? Purchasing 90% Complete >Am going this afternoon to look at a "90%" complete canard aircraft..this >one's a Vari-Eze. Any quick clues on first glance items to check or questions >to ask? Am very serious about finding one to finish/fly. Thanks in advance >for any replys/advice. Chip Slade Chip, there are so many things to consider, I hardly know where to start. Far too much to try to do a complete list here. I would suggest you scout your local EAA chapter for a very knowlegeble EZ owner to sit and talk with for a while. Then, if possible take him/her with you to look at the aircraft. The wing-mounting system of the Varieze is completely different from the Long and the Cozy. I would want to do a very careful alignment check of the wings before committing to purchase, since there is no "EZ" way to change incidence or sweep, once built. I would want to weigh some of the large parts. I'd want to check out the thrust-line of the motor mount. I'd look very carefully at the canard, with the profile templates for correct airfoil shape, and sight down the leading and trailing edge for straightness, as well as proper elevator positioning and gap. I'd like to do the aileron-hang test for proper balance (this one's easy to screw up on). Since there were more plans-changes on the Varieze than on any of the following Rutan-derived designs, I'd check over the plans to see if all the plans-changes are duely documented and carried out on the structure. I would want to inspect important layups that were still visible (no contouring yet). Pretty good bet that if easily inspectable layups are neatly done, and with correct number of plies, per plans, that the rest of the structure is acurately constructed, as well. I'd look for evidence that the fuel tanks are tested "leak-tight". There is more, but this is where your expert escort can help you. Good Luck. Let us hear how this turns out. Howard Rogers, A&P 2005148 Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 16:57:01 -0500 From: Jeff Russell Subject: Re: COZY: Instruction in a experimental airplane. "Tannen, Christian" wrote: > Hi, > I have a question about the pilot instruction in an experimental plane. > > Can somebody give me the FAA rule number, which say that the owner or > builder of an experimental airplane can learn to fly in is own airplane ? > > Any help will be appreciate > > See you at Sun & Fun '99 > > Christian I did this in a my first experimental I built in 1983. I asked the FAA and they told me I must be signed off for that type to solo it. I could not find a local airplane that was the same type so I asked my CFI if he would sign me off on my first 3 flights / landings with him and he said he would look at me from the ground. I had already proven that I could solo a C-172 and he knew that I had hundreds of hours in ultralites. This is what I did and he signed me off. I did the rest of my time in my airplane except for my long cross country and check ride. -- Jeff Russell From: "Nat Puffer" Subject: COZY: CAFE Foundation Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 05:57:10 -0600 Hey Guys, Check the article on Mark Beduhn's Cozy Mark IV N494 CZ in Sport Aviation, April 1999. A very comprehensive evaluation by the CAFE Foundation. The little discourse on canards providing a smoother ride in turbulence was interesting. I like the comment on page 63, "Its cross country efficiency places it among the top homebuilts in its class." Mark and his family stopped at our house on the way out to Santa Rosa, CA. It was a lot of effort and expense on his part to have this study done, and all of us benefit. Thank you, Mark! Nat From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Sat, 3 Apr 1999 11:43:24 -0600 (CST) Subject: Re: COZY: CAFE Foundation Ditto on Nat's comment "a smoother ride in turbulence" I have often been tempted when giving a PIREP on tubulence to upgrade the severity by one step. If your working to keep the wings level in an EZ, the others call it Severe. Have had a G-IV and 737 land after us, where their wings were all over the place, and it was an easy landing for us. ps: Sorry about the gasoline april fool, I was brain dead when I passed it on. From: mbeduhn@juno.com Date: Mon, 5 Apr 1999 21:41:22 -0500 Subject: COZY: I'm back! Hi everyone! The movers dropped off our stuff today (tons of boxes), and the first thing I did was hook up my computer so I could check my Cozy E-mail. Last week I was able to fly my Cozy from Conway Arkansas to Oshkosh where it is now safely hangered (3 hours and 23 minutes of pure fun). When I flew in, I was just about ready to call the tower (12 miles out) when a Cessna announced that he was 8 miles out, apparently right in front of me. Bummer! I was showing a ground speed of 180 knots, and at that speed I would be on top of him in a couple of minutes!! I called the tower, and they sequenced me behind the Cessna. I told the controller that I was trying to slow down from 180 knots, and that I still didn't see the traffic. He warned to keep looking, and not to run over the Cessna. A few seconds later he called me and told me to keep my speed up and pass the Cessna. The controller called the Cessna and warned him that he was being overtaken by "a very high speed aircraft". I couldn't help smile when he said that, because it is fun to be flying a fast plane and go screaming by Cessna's and Pipers like they are standing still! For those of you who are still building, that is just a taste of some of the fun you will have flying your Cozy. Mark Beduhn Cozy IV N494CZ (now hangered at the big "O") ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] Date: Tue, 06 Apr 1999 22:46:02 -0400 From: Brian Freitag Subject: COZY: How big is it? Well first I need to thank everybody for the reply on my last E-mail test. Second I need to appoligize for sending that to everybody, But What I wanted to send didnt go through like I thought. So I am re typing my questions to you . I just bought a cozy project which i am pleased about, nevertheless I need to transport this fine plane home, so I need to ask some of you your opinion on the best way to get it home on my car trailer. I allready know it is 11' 6" inches wide from strake to strake, thats not a real problem but I was wondering if I could stand this up on the firewall to bring it home and make it look like the shuttle. I would like to know what the length is from nose to firewall, so maybe I could make a mount to bolt on where the engine mounts to then bolt that to the trailer, provided its not to tall. Also if I could get a length on the wing unbolted from the plane so I can see if it will fit in the back of my truck..........thanx in advance .....Brian Date: Wed, 07 Apr 1999 09:13:06 -0500 From: Michael Amick Subject: Re: COZY: How big is it? Brian Freitag wrote: > I would like to know what the length is from nose to firewall, Fuselage length firewall to F22 =102" F22 to nose 22" + est 6" for nose bowl =28" total firewall to nose = 130" or 10 feet 10 inches approximately Regards Michael Amick From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Wed, 7 Apr 1999 16:56:03 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: COZY: How big is it? What distance, kinds of roads are involved. First choice would be on the gear or flat attitude and bank, securely tied down to a flat trailer. For local you probably could get away with just doing it. Any further distance, you would need oversize highway permits for every state you are going through. The permits are available by the states, could start with State highway patrol, or call a local trucking company that specializes in machinery moving. Probably they can obtain the permits for you (might try the WWW), are set up with an account for the various states, or can suggest an organization that can. Not too difficult to get, but they can specify route, and no travel at night. The Cosy manual (and I think all Ez's [The MKIV is wider spar]) have a drawing showing the distance to block one axle up, for the horizontal projection of the spar to be under the highway width limits. This blocking must be strong enough for horizontal loads of panic braking. Vertical space shuttle style, the wind load on the vertical projection of the fuselage will be sizable, possibly 30 pounds/sq.ft. x 10' high and 2' wide = 600 lbs. plus any loads due to bouncing. Thats for lengthwise loads. For winds perpendicular to highway travel, the loads could be more due to strake area. The issue becomes probably a light trailer, with a horizontal load at a relatively high elevation. A gust of wind and a chuck hole on the appropriate side, the whole thing could tip over. I would if going this way, use a heavy trailer, say one weighing at least 2000 lbs., Make a bolted (not nailed) timber frame bolted through the spar wing bolt holes. A caution, some flexibilty is needed since the spar is stiff, the trailer may not be. Then with 2" wide nylon webbing (like seat belt material) make a dog muzzle sort of harness to fit over the nose with webbing to 4 corners of the trailer. The nose will sway several inches, and the flexibilty (above) need to accomodate. The timber support ONLY transfers horizontal (wind and chuckholes) and vertical gravity and bumps loads. It must be loose to any rotation loads. From: SBLANKDDS@aol.com Date: Thu, 8 Apr 1999 19:41:48 EDT Subject: COZY: Re: [c-a] EZ VIDEO SOURCE The end of the Rutan and Mellvill video on "Building Composites" shows some EZ flying. Take off, and nice air to air video. The construction portion of the video is a must see. They show hot wire technique, flat layups and compound curve layups. Steve From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 22:15:40 -0500 (CDT) Subject: COZY: Sun N Fun notes Here are my lasting thoughts of equipment, etc. from last week (no special order): 1: An electronic flight director: was only readable nearly straight on. Nice for one for each front seat, but unuable by copilot when only one installed. This is common with LCD displays. 2: Cleveland Brakes have new metallic linings, the amount of heat generated is the same for a given weight and speed. Pedal pressure is reportedly the same. Don't use them with chromed disks (like mine are), they will tear up the chrome! I didn't ask what the benefit is, possibly better wear. Both organic and metallic linings require a conditioning (each is different) when new or used lightly. Cleveland wants you to stand on them to keep them coditioned wich is when you get the best coefficient of friction. 3: Showed and suggested both Jeff Russell and Nat consider the Cosy Classic front hinged canopy as an approved option on their designs. Uli Woelter (Cosy Classic designer) has been selling details for $25.00, and I have been providing my gas spring details free. I have furnished several sets of details over the last months. Jeff liked the idea, Nat thought it would be like mating to different breed dogs, and spoil the breed. 4: Liked the Positech oil coolers, they are said to be 10% more efficient than the Stewart Warner coolers, also the 360 cooler is slightly larger than the 320. Probably will replace my harrison cooler in the near future, considering going to the 360 if it will fit without a lot of cowling mods. 5: Found a heavier saw mandel for the dremel. 6: Someone reported my Lightspeed engineering prop spinner was wobbling. Removed it for flights home. Will investigate plus test flight to see if it really does increase speed. On the way home, and more heavily loaded than my usual prop test flights, at 2 times near 4000', the cruise speed was 170k and 177K, I would usually expect 173k with this prop, which is too flat of a pitch at this altitude. I like the idea of Jeff Russell's skull cap spinner, but it needs a 7" dia. crush plate, and I have a 6". Probably change in the near future. From: "Brent Sites" Subject: COZY: high altitude performance Date: Tue, 20 Apr 1999 23:36:16 -0700 I live in the middle of the mountains. Our airport is at about 7,500'. I was wondering how well the cozy mark IV will perform taking off at this altitude with the recommended engine. My main use will be to transport my family at a combined weight of roughly 550 lbs. Does anyone have much experience with it at high altitudes..or foresee any difficulties? thanks Brent Sites bsites@bewellnet.com From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1999 17:05:08 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: COZY: high altitude performance What airport, what are runway lengths, prevailing winds, runway slope. My standard conditions takeoff distance is 1800' runway run. Using my Sporty's takeoff performance computer at 90F, and 7500', level, and no wind, I calculate 6300'. This is actual ground run! I would add 10% for safety, then 7000' is minimum. At Colorado Springs at 86F I used 4600', which the calculator prediced within 100' One thing you never whant to do with a canard, is rotate to early, you may clear the ground, but WILL skim the runway for 500' or 1000' before achieving best angle of climb speed and be able to clear obstructions. From: ZeroGCorp1@aol.com Date: Fri, 23 Apr 1999 08:48:09 EDT Subject: COZY: The list is great I don't want to invoke a bunch of additional bandwidth here by saying this, but I really must send out a big thanks for this list. The posts, both the list and offline, from many builders is really going to be a big help. One problem is I find myself flipping ahead when I see certain posts to figure out what they are talking about. Guess that may be good for avoiding future mistakes, but it is really going to impede productivity on the plane if I spend all my time at on e-mail and "research." I do appreciate all of the input. I can't say how much time has been saved by finding Wicks Aircraft, with the chapter sections kits. It was on one of the many builders pages out there and it has been a big help. All of my material for chapter's 4-8 arrived and it all came well boxed and in good shape. Oh yeah, I used the "balance" this week mixing epoxy for test layups and such...it was great fun building it, great that the physics work out, and worked perfectly as advertised; but sorry, I can't even imagine laying up a wing with this thing...My pump will be sitting in its toasty Styrofoam coffin by the end of the weekend-promise! on to F-22..... (six years?, whew...) Ray Cronise (Flight minus 2190 days and counting....) From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Thu, 22 Apr 1999 18:20:42 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: COZY: Indications this project is dragging on... I only planned enough to have the required materials and modification details available when I needed them, considering delivery times and thinking ahead more or less only to do order things. Would start thinking of items I wanted to change in advance, giving some time for ideas to settle in, but there were items that could only be final planned when I got there. I was pushing Uli Woelter for drawings (I became the proof of plans for the Classic) the full time. I was one step at a time, and when that was complete, did the next step. Sometimes were done out of sequence from the instructions which caused lost time looking for a detail in an earlier chapter. Took 4700 hours in 3.5 years, while working at job 40 hours a week. I think trying to write down a schedule what I plan to complete for 6 months or a year or 2 in advance would be depressing, since this is for education/recreation, and for 99% of the builders this is a first endevour, I don't know how one could even with low accuracy predict how many hours a task will take since they are not experienced in this work. A task is complete when its complete and ALL items are done correctly with best workmanship you can muster. I have been paid for construction management/scheduling for 30+ years, and even after building one plane, I think I would be hard pressed to make a rough schedule for another. Trying to stick with a schedule does not allow for the difficulties and goofs in unknown areas, and DOES promote poor workmanship and cutting corners which is a NO-NO. From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 17:42:48 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: COZY: Just wanting to say Hi from a new builder. Was asked > > 1. Speed Tricks Excellent workmanship is the best, there are little things, landing gear fairing, flush rudder belhorns, hershey kiss prop spinner, wheel pants. > 2. Retractable Mains They take fuel space, if you forget to put down, you aren't going anywhere for more than a few days. Land nose gear up, minor damage, most of the time keep going. Expensive, more weight - much longer runway required, weight is very valuable on an EZ. > 3. Wider Cabin The MKIV is nice width, how big are you?? weight, and height?? I can tell you more when I know this. > 4. Best Engine for the Bucks & Performance & Safety. (Certified / Auto) Most of the Lycoming 320 or 360 work well, build and fly awhile then if you feel competent think about a different engine. There havwe been several that have started with auto engines and switched to Lycoming. There are a few flying with auto engines, but it requires special expertice to do successfully. With the Lycomings, it is a well proven installation, there are enough other variables on a homebuilt airplane. Its good to have aircraft equipment if you have a problem at a distant airport, I don't think you will find many aircraft mechanics willing to put their liabilty on a line with none aircraft equipment. > 5. Any and all CAD files. ( Owning a CNC Machine Shop should have some >advantages & I would like to offer help to you in this regard.) There are not many cad files that will be useful for CNC machines, there just isn't that many machined parts. If you want to do something go into business as competition for Brock, but get Nat's approval of the parts as an approved supplier first. > >Even though I have 24 years A&P experience I am as green as they come with >respect building a MK-4. It starts with simple parts to make, and gradually gets more complicated. Plenty of support from Nat and everyone else. Become a member of Central States Assoc. see Canard.com for a link. Date: Sat, 01 May 1999 18:15:54 -0400 From: "Marc J. Zeitlin" Subject: COZY: General Questions Brian Dempster wrote: >A few of the things I would like input on are; > > 1. Speed Tricks > 2. Retractable Mains > 3. Wider Cabin > 4. Best Engine for the Bucks & Performance & Safety. (Certified / Auto) > 5. Any and all CAD files. All of these subjects have been discussed many times in the past. The best thing to do is to read the mailing list archives for the past 4 years (1995, 1996, 1997, 1998) and this year, read the FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) list, and THEN, if your question is still not answered, feel free to come back to the list with it. So, you say, where the heck is this archive? Michael Roe wrote: >Where can one go to find the archived postings for this e-mail list? There >are a few subjects I would like to research. The email list archives can most easily be accessed on the web at: http://cozy.canard.com/mail_list/ You can either go to the year/topic page of interest and read the topic you choose, or else you can download a "zipped" file of the whole year's worth of topics. The FAQ can be accessed at the same address. For any of you that do NOT have web access, you can retrieve the archives (same files) via email. The instructions are in the Charter you received when you joined, and you can get an updated copy of the charter by sending an email to: majordomo@canard.com with the lines: get cozy_builders ml_charter end in it. The "Subject" line of the message doesn't matter - you can leave it blank or put in anything you wish. >Also...Are there any COZY MKIV builders here in Colorado? For those of you who would like to get an updated builders list (those on this mailing list) send an email to: majordomo@canard.com with the lines: get cozy_builders mailing_list end in it. Hope this helps. -- Marc J. Zeitlin mailto:marcz@ultranet.com http://www.ultranet.com/~marcz/ From: "Brian & Susan DeFord" Subject: Re: COZY: Re: Just wanting to say Hi from a new builder. Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 17:35:43 -0700 Hold on there, Gary... I am going to have to step in here and state my piece before this gets way out of hand. Carl has a right to his opinion and when asked for it can let it be known. Unfortunately, IMHO, Carl seems to have a way of making his opinion sound like facts when they are only opinion. JD has, in his opinion, had one of his products misrepresented by Carl and certainly has a right to set the story straight. JD has been involved in the canard community for many, many years and has helped advance it in ways other than his products such as the landing gear. You make an unfair statement regarding JD and his motives and I believe he deserves an apology. He certainly wasn't trying to sell his gear by his reply, only defending his product. Let's not make Carl the only voice in this forum. He certainly isn't the only one with an opinion. I don't agree with his opinion on retract gears. It certainly isn't accurate when considering Infinity gears as JD was trying to point out. And, in case you are wondering, I am not installing JD's gear in my MK-IV, though I have considered it. One of the benefits of this forum is the varied number of opinions given that allow a person to make up his/her mind about a subject under discussion instead of one way being crammed down their throat. Let's keep it that way. Regards, Brian DeFord Gary Dwinal wrote: >With all due respect Mr. Newman I think you are way out of line making a statement of this >nature to Carl who is one of the most respected members of this forum. Carl is one of if >not the most helpful and knowledgeable people from the canard community on this forum >group and has helped me and many, many others on here. You, on the other hand have >only one motive and one motive only for coming onto this forum and that is to do or say >whatever you feel you must to sell your landing gear and MAKE MONEY!!!! >So, as I say , with all do respect, unless you have positive, constructive comments to make >maybe you should just keep your sales commercials to yourself. LCDR James D. Newman wrote: > Hi Carl and All, > > > Carl Denk wrote: > > Was asked > > > 2. Retractable Mains > > > They take fuel space, if you forget to put down, you aren't going anywhere for more than a few > days. Land nose gear up, minor damage, most of the time keep going. Expensive, more weight - much > longer runway required, weight is very valuable on an EZ. > > This is not true! There ya go talk'n about something you know nothing about again. You > obviously have not read my web site. > I'm not going to go into great detail (see my web site, info pack, video and / or call me for > that), but you don't lose any gas in a MK-IV; with all the lights and horns, forgetting to put down > the gear in ANY aircraft is like forgetting to put your pants on (there are other underlying > problems here); our main retracts are not expensive for what you get and compared with what it > replaces, and it pays for itself in many ways besides better economy; you don't gain any weight in a > MK-IV; and the take-off roll is shorter. All this is well documented by the customers who are > already flying. > Again, simply read my web site thoroughly, and / or call me to find out the facts. > HTH. > > Infinity's Forever, > > JD From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 21:06:06 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: COZY: Re: Just wanting to say Hi from a new builder. Was wrote: I am not installing JD's gear >in my MK-IV, though I have considered it. What was your thinking, why didn't you install?? > I (Carl said) . Land nose gear up,(with fixed mains) minor damage, most of the time keep going. - Has happened to me, this is fact. >Expensive, If I remember right more than a few thousand dollars, to me that expensive. more weight - I believe this to be true, JD - whats the weight difference between the Featherlite strut and hardware and the retracts on the market including all items to power and control it. - much longer runway required, - well maybe not much but if there is additional weight there must be more speed required for takeoff and landing. Is the main axle location the same? What is the effect on the C.G.? but you don't lose any gas in a MK-IV WHere does the gear stow? In a Mk IV everthing from the center spar forward is fuel. It doesn't count to put fuel except where the plans show. forgetting to put down the gear in ANY aircraft is like forgetting -- OF COURSE, its not if, its when! Sorry if I offended someone, but all of my comments are my own thoughts unless I note a source. From: lschuler@cellular.uscc.com Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 09:55:48 -0600 Subject: Re: COZY: Just wanting to say Hi from a new builder. Brian Dempster wrote: >A few of the things I would like input on are; >1. Speed Tricks Assuming you are talking about build time (rather than cruise speed), Jeff Russell sells a bunch of excellent Cozy parts, including wings; if Nat's "approved list" is important to you (which it may not be if you are considering auto engines and wider tub), check with Nat. >2. Retractable Mains Debates abound on this one, as is the case for just about anything that even slightly deviates from the plans. As always it all comes down to personal choices for your "experiment". Biggest single advantage is much wider wheel base and thus stability. Weight is close to a wash. Can put a sump tank in normal gear area which adds back capacity or reserve lost to wheel wells. More expensive, but pay back may be efficiency long term. Sure are snarky looking. Infinity makes them. Adds some flight complexity, but no more complex than a production retract plane and tons of those flying. Very big plus is that the retract gear has been drop tested per FARs which cannot be said for the 'stock' gear on ANY canard airplane (retract as in Velocity, or the standard hoop-types) to my knowledge. >3. Wider Cabin Consider adding 6" to width (makes 48" at front seat back). After flying in the CAFE Cozy recently (Thanks loads Mark!) it makes some very good sense. Basically I'd added 3" on either side of BL-0; MUST remember as you build to add the inches to "everything". As part of the widening, add 1/2" to either side of the heat duct for total 1" wider center consol/arm rest; add 1/2" to outside arm rests to make them nicer for a big elbow and eliminate the stick from hitting the side (as well as eliminated the 1/8" stick depression called out in the plans); the remaining 2" on either side of BL-0 could be used in the leg cut-outs in the instrument panel; totaly diferent nose, canopy, cowling, turtleback and so on. TONS (repeat TONS) of added work; but, TONS (repeat TONS) of pay back in comfort. Biggest down side may be added lifting body affect (deep stall stuff) and some structural concerns. >4. Best Engine for the Bucks & Performance & Safety. (Certified > Auto) "Best" engine is, as everything else, debatable. Some folks like me are using Subaru SVX engines. Last year these were prodused was 1996. Lots of them still out there. Don't pay more than $3,500.00 for the engine, wiring, sensors, computer and all. These things are just getting broken in at 50,000 miles (if they are maintained properly, which is a kicker, cause ya never know). You could opt for a used cert engine, but if you intend to work on it yourself, you de-certify it and it then becomes just as experimental as an auto engine. Safety is in the eye of the beholder. Yer on yer own. Only comment I'd make relative to engines is that folks who try to get more out of an engine than the designer intended (suping up a Buick V-8 or supercharging a stock Lycoming for example) generally tend to get lots of power for a short period of time (low reliability). Good luck. Larry Schuler MK-IV plans #500 Ch-14 Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 10:41:21 -0700 From: "LCDR James D. Newman" Subject: COZY: Re: Just wanting to say Hi from a new builder. Hi Gary, > Gary Dewinal wrote: > With all due respect Mr. Newman I think you are way out of line making a statement of this nature to Carl who is one of the most respected members of this forum. Carl is one of if not the most helpful and knowledgeable people from the canard community on this forum group and has helped me and many, many others on here. LOL! Ya need to learn to lighten up - this is a fun group. E-mail is tough enough without people taking things out of context. You obviously must be new to the group. I know and have met Carl, and we are always bantering and / or complementing each other, privately and on the group (many of us group old timers do it). Carl, and those who have been on the group for a while, well knows that I meant nothing disrespectful, just was helping ol Carl out with a few misconceptions ;-) . Also, I realize I'm a no body and never have had anything to contribute to the group, and have only been into aviation all my life, and only been in the canard world since '82, but be assured I made no inaccurate statements. > You, on the other hand have only one motive and one motive only for coming onto this forum and that is to do or say whatever you feel you must to sell your landing gear and MAKE MONEY!!!! HA! Now that's a laugh!! You are greatly delusional if you think I am on this forum for only "one motive and one motive only". I was *asked* long ago by the illustrious members to join this group because of my VAST expertise in many areas. Also, I NEVER just say whatever I feel to sell anything. If you took the time to know me, and Carl, you would know this well and not sent your post. If I wanted to "MAKE MONEY" on my landing gear, I wouldn't be selling it so inexpensively. My landing gear comes from my Infinity 1, and I make it available for those who want something better for all the logical reasons listed on my web site who want a all retractable plane. Hell if I wanted to "MAKE MONEY", I wouldn't be involved with aviation. Haven't you heard how to make a little money in aviation, start with a lot :-) . Also, if I was only into "MAKING MONEY", I wouldn't be living in a 2 bit apartment trying to help my fellow home builders. > So, as I say , with all do respect, unless you have positive, constructive comments to make maybe you should just keep your sales commercials to yourself. I've never made a "sales commercial" to this group. If you would take the time to read the archive's, you'll see that ALL I have ever done for this group is make "positive, constructive comments". Take care, and call anytime if you have any other questions. Infinity's Forever, EAA Nat'l & LCL Member EAA Technical Counselor JD EAA Flight Advisor AOPA Member Test Pilot James D. Newman, Pres/CEO/CFO SOTW, OJAAT LCDR F-14 USNR Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 10:42:21 -0700 From: "LCDR James D. Newman" Subject: COZY: Re: Just wanting to say Hi from a new builder. Hi Carl, > > Expensive, If I remember right more than a few thousand dollars, to me that expensive. > > more weight - I believe this to be true, JD - whats the weight difference between the Featherlite strut and hardware and the > retracts on the market including all items to power and control it. > > - much longer runway required, - well maybe not much but if there is additional weight there must be more speed required for > takeoff and landing. Is the main axle location the same? What is the effect on the C.G.? > > but you don't lose any gas in a MK-IV > > WHere does the gear stow? In a Mk IV everthing from the center spar forward is fuel. It doesn't count to put fuel except where > the plans show. > > forgetting to put down the gear in ANY aircraft is like forgetting -- OF COURSE, its not if, its when! Again Grasshopper, ALL the answers you seek can be found in great detail in my web site, info pack, video and / or just call me (Marc and Larry, how's that for Yin and Yang?). :-) Infinity's Forever, JD Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 17:54:48 -0700 From: Steve Hagan Subject: COZY: re-sale liability I'm new to the news group; so this may be a dumb question. If I choose to sell my Cozy at any point during/after construction is there any way to avoid personal liability for the rest of the life of the airframe? Steve Hagan eagerly waiting for my plans Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 22:13:07 -0400 From: Steele Olmstead Subject: Re: COZY: re-sale liability; Hey, here's that person wisely trying to [To all the lawyer bashers: Here is a smart person who is using our system logically, wisely and not having the right to go to court cut off.] Yes Mr. Hagan, there is. You simply sell the "parts" to the plane and have the purchaser sign a release which exonerates you from liability and acknowledging you are selling him/her a plane. Any competent personal injury lawyer can help you with such a release. Call the local Bar Association and the person there can direct you to such a professional. Steve Hagan wrote: > I'm new to the news group; so this may be a dumb question. If I choose > to sell my Cozy at any point during/after construction is there any way > to avoid personal liability for the rest of the life of the airframe? > > Steve Hagan > eagerly waiting for my plans From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 21:23:00 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: COZY: re-sale liability On 05/19/99 17:54:48 you wrote: > >I'm new to the news group; so this may be a dumb question. If I choose >to sell my Cozy at any point during/after construction is there any way >to avoid personal liability for the rest of the life of the airframe? > >Steve Hagan >eagerly waiting for my plans > > Probably not 100%, but can reduce liability. Avemco insurance with the EAA endorsement covers for several years (depends on how long you have had them for insurance, etc) after you have sold. Having buyer's mechanic do an annual, a good checkout by someone of his choosing, and properly worded paperwork would be a good start. From: "Russ Fisher" Subject: Re: COZY: re-sale liability; Hey, here's that person wisely trying to avoid liability. Date: Wed, 19 May 1999 23:29:28 -0400 OK, I couldn't help it. Here's my $0.02 worth. I work in a hospital. EVERY SINGLE PATIENT signs a release for EVERY SINGLE PROCEDURE performed on them which outlines all the risks involved, up to and including death. If releases truly worked, there would be NO MALPRACTICE SUITS! I rest my case. Russ Fisher -----Original Message----- From: Steele Olmstead >Yes Mr. Hagan, there is. You simply sell the "parts" to the plane and have >the purchaser sign a release which exonerates you from liability and >acknowledging you are selling him/her a plane. Any competent personal >injury lawyer can help you with such a release. Call the local Bar >Association and the person there can direct you to such a professional. From: "Nat Puffer" Subject: Re: COZY: re-sale liability; Hey, here's that person wisely trying to avoid liability. Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 13:41:56 -0500 Builders, I think Burt said one time that you should have the purchaser sign a statement in which he agrees that the airplane will kill him. Nat ---------- > From: Russ Fisher > To: cozy_builders@canard.com > Subject: Re: COZY: re-sale liability; Hey, here's that person wisely trying to avoid liability. > Date: Wednesday, May 19, 1999 10:29 PM > > OK, I couldn't help it. Here's my $0.02 worth. I work in a hospital. > EVERY SINGLE PATIENT signs a release for EVERY SINGLE PROCEDURE performed on > them which outlines all the risks involved, up to and including death. If > releases truly worked, there would be NO MALPRACTICE SUITS! I rest my case. > > Russ Fisher > > -----Original Message----- > From: Steele Olmstead > > > > >Yes Mr. Hagan, there is. You simply sell the "parts" to the plane and have > >the purchaser sign a release which exonerates you from liability and > >acknowledging you are selling him/her a plane. Any competent personal > >injury lawyer can help you with such a release. Call the local Bar > >Association and the person there can direct you to such a professional. > > Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 16:27:05 -0500 From: Kent Ashton Subject: Re: COZY: re-sale liability This is just whistling in the dark. OK, I buy your "parts". Take a photo of the plane I just bought, which is in fact, not a collection of parts but an airplane. I crash and sue you anyway. I show the jury you sold me an airplane. I think there are a lot of things you can do to protect yourself from being sued: have buyer sign a release, fully disclose any defects, fully disclose your (lack of) qualifications as a designer and engineer, don't get so rich you invite lawsuits. You can be sued no matter what kind of tricks you try to play, and I think a jury would look more favorably on a person who honestly conveyed the condition of the airplane to the seller than one who is trying to trick the system. --Kent A. Steele Olmstead wrote: > You simply sell the "parts" to the plane and have > the purchaser sign a release which exonerates you from liability and > acknowledging you are selling him/her a plane From: "Ryan Amendala" Subject: Re: COZY: re-sale liability avoid liability. Date: Fri, 21 May 1999 10:23:49 PDT All, Sorry for the waste of bandwidth but what if you were a company that was a licensed and bonded LLC say with at $10,000 bond. And if you were to sell an airplane licensed under such a company would that protect you? There are a lot of "home businesses" that could fall into this catigory some of which might be homebuilder owned. This may be a question for Steele. Thanks Ryan > >Steele Olmstead wrote: > > >You simply sell the "parts" to the plane and have > > the purchaser sign a release which exonerates you from liability and > > acknowledging you are selling him/her a plane > _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com Date: Thu, 20 May 1999 19:47:52 -0700 From: "LCDR James D. Newman" Subject: COZY: Re: re-sale liability; Hey, here's that person wisely trying to avoid Hi Nat and All, > Nat Puffer wrote: > Builders, > I think Burt said one time that you should have the purchaser sign a > statement in which he agrees that the airplane will kill him. The RAF Oct. 1988 Canard Pusher Newsletter #57 page 7 & 8, had a "Mandatory Ground" Plans Change requiring the RAF builder placarding both his/her aircraft and Owner's Manual with a new "Warning". The "Warning" is for those who may purchase or ride in your plane. It basically states that home builts are more likely to have an accident, including a fatal accident, than spam cans, to adhere to strict maintenance and operating procedures, and that the danger is greatest during initial flight or when operating in a non conservative manner. It's interesting reading of how the "Warning" came about and it's exact wording, if your interested. It may be a good "Warning" to have in ALL Sport Aircraft, the aircraft's associated documents and Owners Manual [ I don't like to use the terms "Home Built" or "Experimental" because of the connotation to Joe and Jane Public :-) ]. Infinity's Forever, JD Date: Sat, 22 May 1999 13:49:40 -0500 From: David Domeier Subject: Re: COZY: re-sale liability Steve, re "If I choose to sell my Cozy at any point during/after construction is there any way to avoid personal liability for the rest of the life of the airframe?" This is a late come back, but I submit my thoughts and experience on the subject for your perusal. I was very serious about selling my LEZ some years ago, but eventually took it off the market and donated it to a tax exempt organization under circumstances that precluded it ever flying again. I recouped about 35% of my investment in a legitimate tax write off. Here's why I did it. There is no way to duck the liability issue. If you build it, you're liable, forever. And the cost of defending yourself against the widow of a dead drunk pilot can easily exceed the value of the airplane. In the long run, for peace of mind, decide right now before you start building - I WILL NOT SELL THIS AIRPLANE. Especially, if you have a nest egg to lose. This activity, to me, is like belonging to a country club or taking a long expensive vacation. It's money spent for fun and I don't expect to get much of it back.....if the airplane is sold, there is a remote possibility it could cost you a lot more, as I said, than it is worth. dd From: SWrightFLY@aol.com Date: Sun, 23 May 1999 11:30:17 EDT Subject: Re: COZY: re-sale liability In a message dated 5/22/99 1:48:51 PM Central Daylight Time, david010@earthlink.net writes: << re "If I choose to sell my Cozy at any point during/after construction is there any way to avoid personal liability for the rest of the life of the airframe?" >> The short answer is no as you describe very well in the following; <> When I sold my Varieze 5 years ago, I made sure that I did not own anything or have any assets and I set up two living trust, one for me that is empty and one for my wife who has assets. If you own nothing and have no assets, then, when and if you are sued you file bankruptcy. This way the lawyers that filed the frivolous suite and are "fishing for a payoff" get nothing. You simply go to a bankruptcy lawyer and let him take care of it. This will cost a few hundred dollars but just consider it an "insurance payment." It is difficult for some folks to transfer all assets to the spouse or other family member and they should just give it away to a museum. You might check with a bankruptcy lawyer as to how this works in your state. This is a very relevant topic for all of us. I invite any "legal eagles" out there to give us your criticism of this thinking. Steve From: Iflycozy@aol.com Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 00:28:07 EDT Subject: Re: COZY: re-sale liability Steve Wright is correct, but to an extent. As a practicing bankruptcy lawyer, and don't hold it against me because I consider myself a Cozy builder, we always look for the "reachback periods" to make sure that all property transfers are outside of the statute of limitations before allowing a debtor to file bankruptcy. For example, in some states, the fraudulent transfer period may be five years. If a plaintiff or a creditor, i.e., a widow of a passenger, can prove that an airplane builder fraudulent transferred all of his/her property to a trust or to someone else, especially including family members, then the transfers may be avoided or declared void by the courts. If certain facts exist, then the bankruptcy court may deny the debtor a discharge. A discharge means that the debtor is no longer legally liable to repay his debts to creditors. There are other provisions in the bankruptcy code that allow creditors relief or a denial of the debtor's discharge if the debtor acted with fraud or malice. The first crazy example I can think of in this short period of time may, and I say "may" very carefully, may be when a builder has constructed an airplane while knowing that he/she has built it improperly and with the intent of selling it as an inherently dangerous piece of machinery to another. In other words, if the builder knows that the plane is not airworthy for the subsequent purchaser, then the builder may have put himself in a situation that may be declared by the bankruptcy court as malicious. Since this example is extreme and I do not intend on briefing the issue to its fullest extent by being verbose, there are always lawyers out there testing the statutes to the limits. As the old captain of Hill Street Blues used to say, "let's be careful out there." Matt B. From: Iflycozy@aol.com Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 00:40:24 EDT Subject: Re: COZY: re-sale liability avoid liability. Just a quick note on this topic, it is my understanding that the FAA will not give a homebuilt airplane its certification to corporations. The applicant for the airworthiness certificate must be a person, not a corporation, etc. As for purchasing an already flying aircraft, I would presume that the same laws to the acquisition of spam cans apply to homebuilts. If a corporation purchases a homebuilt and the pilot screws up, then the corporation may be liable for its negligent acts and the pilot may be liable for his/her negligent acts. I presume that your question really is as follows: If a corporation purchases an already flying homebuilt aircraft and then sells it the next day to another, then what liability would the officers of the corporation have if the plaintiff tries to "pierce the corporate veil?" Good question. Lawyers charge big bucks for an answer to a very short question. My two cents is that it would be liable for the negligence that it committed (or whatever negligence that a plaintiff could prove). Matt B. Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 08:07:56 -0400 From: bil kleb Subject: Re: COZY: re-sale liability avoid liability. Iflycozy@aol.com wrote: > > [...] it is my understanding that the FAA will not give a homebuilt > airplane its certification to corporations. The applicant for > the airworthiness certificate must be a person, not a corporation, etc. apparently not true, try a owner database search with someplace like, http://www.landings.com/ using a search term of "inc". -- bil Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 00:02:49 -0700 From: "LCDR James D. Newman" Subject: COZY: Re: Re-sale Liability Hi Dave, Steve and All, >> David Domeier wrote: >> If I choose to sell my Cozy at any point during/after construction is there any way to avoid > personal liability for the rest of the life of the airframe? There is no way to duck the > liability issue. If you build it, you're liable, forever. And the cost of defending yourself > against the widow of a dead drunk pilot can easily exceed the value of the airplane > Steve Wright wrote: > When I sold my Varieze 5 years ago, I made sure that I did not own anything or have any assets and > I set up two living trust, one for me that is empty and one for my wife who has assets. If you > own nothing and have no assets, then, when and if you are sued you file bankruptcy. This way the > lawyers that filed the frivolous suite and are "fishing for a payoff" get nothing. You simply go > to a bankruptcy lawyer and let him take care of it. This will cost a few hundred dollars but just > consider it an "insurance payment." It is difficult for some folks to transfer all assets to the > spouse or other family member and they should just give it away to a museum. > You might check with a bankruptcy lawyer as to how this works in your state. This is a very > relevant topic for all of us. I invite any "legal eagles" out there to give us your criticism of > this thinking. I've heard a lot of ideas on this topic. Some are listed below (in no particular order): * start a company and incorporate it in Nevada. After you license your plane, sell your plane to the company. Then the only asset of the company is the plane. So if you have an incident (there's no such thing as an accident), someone can only sue the company which has nothing; * have the company owned by an off shore Trust, and you are just it's manager. Now the plane is twice removed from you; * put all your assets in a Trust (whether you build a plane or not); * make sure you use the EAA's Technical Councilor and Flight Advisor Programs; * if you give someone a ride (including friends and relatives), they and their spouse (even if you don't ever give the spouse a ride) MUST sign a waiver. Check with EAA for the appropriate form, and/or a lawyer, then modify the form to suit your needs; * if you sell the plane, you sell the company and it's assets - the plane; * when you sell the plane (or salvage), the new buyer AND his/her spouse MUST sign a Purchase Agreement that contains a Hold Harmless and Indemnity Agreement, and ALL this is done in front of a Notary. The purpose of having the spouse sign is because ~87% of all plane accidents is pilot error. The spouse is then convinced by a lawyer to sue, even though it's frivolous. Without the spouses signature, the rest we know what happens. Recently, there has been a landmark case where a company was being sued by the widow (who had not signed anything) because of pilot error, and the case was still thrown out. DO YOUR HOME WORK!; * if you sell your plane, turn in the "N" number to the FAA, and sell the plane as salvage (or as a lawn dart, or a flower pot - there's a Long-EZ flower pot in Santa Barbara), sell it "as is", and that the new owner has looked over the salvage. Also, maybe sell the salvage WITHOUT the canard (and maybe without the prop too). The new owner will have to build a new canard and present the salvage as a new plane to the FAA for certification through the Phase I process into the Phase II certificate; * the Bungie Jumper outfits video tape all their customers signing a waiver proving that they read the agreement and knew all the risks. Evidently holds up pretty well. So video tape the airplane sale which is before a Notary; * when you sell your plane, the new owner must buy an insurance policy to cover and protect you for 18 years. 18 years is the new statute of limitations for aircraft mfg. Yes, it's still a long time, and it's not fair compared to limitations other mfg. of products enjoy (90 days), but it's better than it used to be; i.e. - no limitation at all. There are still efforts afoot to lower the limitation time frame. This is one of he many reasons ALL pilots need to be members of AOPA and EAA, for they are our only voice against the huumaans who want to control and/or take away our sport; * if somehow, after all the above, the case is not thrown out and you do get sued (the judge must be a friend of the suing lawyer), automatically counter sue the person(s) suing you so that when you win your case you will recover your expenses plus; HTH. Infinity's Forever, JD Date: Wed, 26 May 1999 08:35:02 +0200 From: "Rego Burger" Subject: COZY: Re-sale Liability FEARS The ENCOURAGING e-mails are good. Well done guys... this is what the forum is for. Don't let fear control you, manage it! This is what Steve Wright and others are getting at. The two basic reactions is "Run" or "Stand and fight" both goals hope to achieve Protection of self. I feel driving on narrow roads is a greater RISK than flying, yet we do it every day without thinking. So a warning of RISK is not a negative but a test, how are you going to react and deal with it? List your options and choose the best shot! I was an anti-home builder some year ago, I could not believe that people could build their wn aeroplanes and fly them safely.... I stuck to Mr. Cessna and Mr. Piper, this was my security zone. Then it happened, taking an S.A. Airways ground crew friend of mine for his first time flip in a C150, 22-25min into the flight a serious shaking had us both staring at each other, ROD 350ft/min, not good! The worst thing was we were circling a fishing boat 2 miles out to sea, I guess they thought this was real funny. I had less than 2min. to get back to the coast, boy it was hard work, I remember having clear options in my mind - panic or do your best. I saw a good spot of field pointed the nose at it and prepared my now upset passenger for an "early" landing. The motor stopped on short finals but it was a text book conclusion to the day,clear of the fence to touch down. A valve had lost it's retaining clips. Now Mr. Lycoming and I were not good friends anymore. Did this stop me from ! flying, heck NO! a bit shook up but I had to get back onto the "bicycle" again. It taught me two things, 1.) Don't fly too far out to sea without floats or a life jacket. 2.) Nothing in this world is perfect, like I had thought until then in regard to production aircraft. My incident motivated me to become a better pilot and to build my own aeroplane. Not everbody reacts this way. My cross country check list now includes a 2-5min "spot the field" look out. :-) Make Fear your Friend! ( he's just warning you ) Régo Burger RSA From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Mon, 24 May 1999 20:17:30 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: COZY: Weight and Balance... Remember when weighing any light aircraft, the aircraft must be indoors (a hangar) with the door closed. Wind across the aifoils, both wing, empenage (canard or horizontal stabilizer) WILL effect the weight and balance. While weighing mine in a hangar with electronic aircraft scales, we were unable to get consistant reading with the door open. With the door closed, the scales settled down and acceptable readings were quickly obtained. From: "Mark West" Subject: COZY: New Member and a few questions Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 18:37:25 -0400 Greetings all from Canada, My name is Mark West and although I am not currently building a Cozy I hope to begin this fall with the construction of a Cozy MkIV. I am located near London Ontario Canada and would love to hear from any builders in the region that may be willing to answer questions as they arise. I just wanted to introduce myself to you all and I have one question, What is Flox that the different builders webpages refer too. If the answer to theis is somewhere online could somebody point me in the right direction. Thank You All, I hope to meet you all at some point in the future Mark Date: Thu, 27 May 1999 22:49:53 -0400 From: "Marc J. Zeitlin" Subject: Fwd: Re: COZY: New Member and a few questions Mark West writes: >...What is Flox that the different builders webpages refer too. If the >answer to theis is somewhere online could somebody point me in the right >direction. Flox is "flocked" cotton mixed in with epoxy. The cotton is chopped up into small fibers (dust, almost) and gives the epoxy some strength as a filler, as opposed to micro-balloons, which is only for shaping but has no strength. Flox is a lot heavier than micro, so you don't use it when you don't need the strength. This (and most of the other terms you'll hear) are described in the plans. If you don't have a set, get one :-). If this isn't in the FAQ, it should be, I think, along with a glossary of most of the regular composite construction terminology. The FAQ is accessible on line at: http://cozy.canard.com/mail_list/ or from majordomo (see the CHARTER you got when you joined for instructions). -- Marc J. Zeitlin mailto:marcz@ultranet.com http://www.ultranet.com/~marcz/ Date: Fri, 28 May 1999 07:12:50 -0400 From: bil kleb Subject: Re: COZY: New Member and a few questions "Marc J. Zeitlin" wrote: > > If this isn't in the FAQ [the definition of flox], it should be, > I think, along with a glossary of most of the regular composite > construction terminology. it's not in the faq since this is not a frequently asked/answered question (afaik) -- probably due to the thoroughness of the education chapter of the plans (chapter 3). however, if anyone would like to create this section, it would be a welcome bonus! btw: thanks again to wayne hicks, an updated faq (added chapters 12, 14, and 18) will be available shortly. if anyone else, beginner or expert, wants to "give back" to the group, write me or see the instructions in the faq itself. we could use yearly updates for chapters 5, 6, 10, 11, and 13 and still need distillations for chapters 15 thru 17 and 19 thru 26, and perennial topics like antennas, brakes, epoxy, deep stall, workshop, etc.; just be sure to check with me first so that we don't have multiple people working on the same chapter or topic... -- bil From: JoeHeag@aol.com Date: Sun, 6 Jun 1999 12:20:50 EDT Subject: COZY: Re: [c-a] Lightning strike II Just one more comment about lightning. Don't think anything in your plane is insulated. This energy goes sceaming through the atmospere several thousands of feet. I don't think a 30 foot bird is going to have anything to prevent its passage (rubber grips included). I like the protection from the rubber tires on your car too. As someone else mentioned, it's the faraday cage set up by the conductive structure of the car (or craft) you're in, not the insulating components. No flame intended, I just think it's a cool thought. Joe Heagerty Cozy Mk IV, Chap. 9 Riverside, CA Date: Wed, 30 Jun 1999 14:07:38 -0500 From: Michael Amick Subject: Re: COZY: twin cozy Carlos, The article refered to in Sport Aviation specified Canadian EAA members and the adrress was: EAA Headquarters Attention: Government Programs P.O. Box 3086 Oshkosh, WI 54903-3086 or Fax to (902) 426-6560 or Email at govt@eaa.org they also give this address for non-eaa members: FAA Milwaukee Flight Standards Office 4915 S. Howell Ave. Milwaukee, WI 53207 and a final phone number for EAA information services (902) 426-4821 I would suggest an email to the govt@eaa.org for clarification. Best regards Michael Amick PS BTW have you made good progress on timing & valve deposits from fuel in your twin? Carlos Vicente León wrote: > We want to go to OSH but need a special FAA waiver to bring experimental > aircraft into the United States. > > Does anyone know how to get this special permission? > > Some one told me that this information is in the latest Sport's > Aviation, but we have not received it. Can anyone look it up ? > > Thanks From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Sat, 10 Jul 1999 07:31:31 -0500 (CDT) Subject: COZY: GPS reliability Sorry for the long message, but for those that have thought of GPS as your only navaid, here fresh from DUATS notams is the list this morning: GPS NOTAMS GPS 06/001 GPS PRN 15 OTS WEF 9906020110 GPS 06/024 GPS DATE DISCONTINUITY FOR GPS RECEIVERS MAY OCCUR ON 21 AUGUST 1999 2359 UTC. THIS IS DUE TO THE ROLLOVER OF THE ELAPSED TIME COUNTER WITHIN THE SATELLITE AT THE COMPLETION OF WEEK 1024 ELAPSED TIME (21 AUGUST 1999). ALL GPS RECEIVER-TIMING COMPUTATIONS ARE BASED ON THE SATELLITE'S ELAPSED TIME COUNTER OUTPUT. THEREFORE OPERATORS WHO USE RECEIVERS NOT CERTIFIED UNDER USA FAA TSO-C129, OR THE EQUIVALENT JAA/NATIONAL DOCUMENTS, SHOULD CONTACT THEIR GPS SUPPLIER AS THEIR RECEIVER MAY BE IMPACTED BY THE ROLLOVER. GPS RECEIVERS MAY EXPERIENCE ONE OF THE FOLLOWING PROBLEMS: UNABLE TO LOCATE SATELLITES RESULTING IN RECEIVER NOT WORKING, TAKE MORE TIME THAN USUAL TO LOCATE SATELLITES, OR APPEAR TO BE WORKING BUT DISPLAYS INACCURATE POSITIONS, TIMES OR DATES. GPS RECEIVERS TSO-C129 CERTIFIED ARE EXPECTED TO OPERATE NORMALLY AT THE ROLLOVER. ADDITIONAL INFORMATION LISTING RECEIVER MANUFACTURERS AND CONTACTS CAN BE FOUND AT www.navcen.uscg.mil/gps/geninfo/y2k/default.htm, OR BY CALLING THE INFORMATION CENTER AT 888-USA-4-Y2K CONSUMERS CAN OBTAIN MANUFACTURER'S Y2K PRODUCT INFORMATION. (MODEL NO., SERIAL NO., AND FIRMWARE VERSION NO. MUST BE PROVIDED). GPS 07/008 GPS PRN 13 OTS WEF 9907070330-9907171200 GPS 07/016 ZAB GPS UNRELIABLE WITHIN A 33 NM RADIUS OF LIBBY VOR (FHU) AT FL400, DECREASING IN AREA WITH DECREASE IN ALTITUDE TO 20 NM RADIUS AT FL250, 12 NM RADIUS AT 10000 AND 1 NM RADIUS AT THE SURFACE. IFR OPERATIONS BASED UPON GPS NAVIGATION SHOULD NOT BE PLANNED IN THE AFFECTED AREA DURING THE PERIODS INDICATED. THESE OPERATIONS INCLUDE DOMESTIC RNAV OR LONG-RANGE NAVIGATION REQUIRING GPS. THESE OPERATIONS ALSO INCLUDE GPS STANDALONE AND OVERLAY INSTRUMENT APPROACH OPERATIONS. 2200-0100 DLY WEF 9907132200-9907150100 GPS 07/017 ZAB GPS NAVIGATIONAL SIGNAL UNRELIABLE WITHIN A 350 NM RADIUS CIRCLE AROUND TRUTH OR CONSEQUENCES VORTAC (TCS) FOR AIRCRAFT AT FL400 OR ABOVE, DECREASING TO 300 NM RADIUS AT FL250 AND 200 NM RADIUS AT 10,000 FT MSL, AND 125 NM RADIUS AT THE SURFACE. IFR OPERATIONS BASED UPON GPS NAVIGATION SHOULD NOT BE PLANNED IN THE AFFECTED AREA DURING THE PERIODS INDICATED. THESE OPERATIONS INCLUDE DOMESTIC RNAV OR LONGRANGE NAVIGATION REQUIRING GPS. THESE OPERATIONS ALSO INCLUDE GPS STANDALONE AND OVERLAY INSTRUMENT APPROACH PROCEDURES. WEF 9907110200-9907110600 GPS 07/018 ZDV GPS NAVIGATIONAL SIGNAL UNRELIABLE WITHIN A 350 NM RADIUS CIRCLE AROUND TRUTH OR CONSEQUENCES VORTAC (TCS) FOR AIRCRAFT AT FL400 OR ABOVE, DECREASING TO 300 NM RADIUS AT FL250 AND 200 NM RADIUS AT 10,000 FT MSL, AND 125 NM RADIUS AT THE SURFACE. IFR OPERATIONS BASED UPON GPS NAVIGATION SHOULD NOT BE PLANNED IN THE AFFECTED AREA DURING THE PERIODS INDICATED. THESE OPERATIONS INCLUDE DOMESTIC RNAV OR LONGRANGE NAVIGATION REQUIRING GPS. THESE OPERATIONS ALSO INCLUDE GPS STANDALONE AND OVERLAY INSTRUMENT APPROACH PROCEDURES. WEF 9907110200-9907110600 GPS 07/019 ZFW GPS NAVIGATIONAL SIGNAL UNRELIABLE WITHIN A 350 NM RADIUS CIRCLE AROUND TRUTH OR CONSEQUENCES VORTAC (TCS) FOR AIRCRAFT AT FL400 OR ABOVE, DECREASING TO 300 NM RADIUS AT FL250 AND 200 NM RADIUS AT 10,000 FT MSL, AND 125 NM RADIUS AT THE SURFACE. IFR OPERATIONS BASED UPON GPS NAVIGATION SHOULD NOT BE PLANNED IN THE AFFECTED AREA DURING THE PERIODS INDICATED. THESE OPERATIONS INCLUDE DOMESTIC RNAV OR LONGRANGE NAVIGATION REQUIRING GPS. THESE OPERATIONS ALSO INCLUDE GPS STANDALONE AND OVERLAY INSTRUMENT APPROACH PROCEDURES. WEF 9907110200-9907110600 From: Robert Donatz Subject: RE: COZY: Oshkosh and long people in MkIV's Date: Fri, 16 Jul 1999 15:10:16 -0700 Fred, I am 6'-2" 190 pounds and had the opportunity to sit in Eric Westland's MkIV at Arlington last weekend. Eric is much shorter than I so his rudder pedal placement didn't match me (he admits to placing his pedal in an extreme aft position). I was able to comfortably place my feet past his pedals with what felt like plenty of room for full rudder displacement. His side stick was about 2" aft of where my left hand naturally fell. Otherwise, my sitting position was very comfortable (more comfortable than any production arrangement, except perhaps for the ability to move around). My "co-pilot" is 5'-7" and we were very pleased with the room we had. I am in the "pre-build" process of gathering facts. I am told that the bulkhead which serves as the front backrest can be placed 2" aft to accommodate "altitude enhanced" pilots. One Idea I'd like to ferment is possibly cutting a hole in that bulkhead for each pilot and creating a structural bucket to help make more room. At first blush, this might also benefit the C.G. Much more deliberation is needed, but those are my thoughts. Good luck, Robert Donatz (MkIV gonnabe) Robert.donatz@precisionint.com -----Original Message----- From: fmooers [SMTP:visnry@itis.com] Sent: Friday, July 16, 1999 4:02 PM To: cozy_builders@canard.com Subject: COZY: Oshkosh Hi, Will be at Oshkkosh on sat for the day, would like to visit with any owners that have their planes at the show. My primary object is to sit in a plane and try it on for size. At 6' and 230#s I am looking for a comfortable seat. Thank you for any consideration. Fred Mooers (visnry@itis.com) Date: Sun, 18 Jul 1999 18:27:32 -0500 From: Kent Ashton Subject: COZY: Airport policies re: homebuilts My local airport, built with FAA grants, does not allow aircraft homebuilding, restoration, rebuilding, warbird maintenance/restoration and heavy owner maintenance (this is oversimplified but essentially true). I believe this violates FAA Assurances and I've filed a complaint with the FAA. If you are based at an Aviation Improvment Program airport (it accepted FAA grants) I need your experiences to support my complaint. This impacts a lot of aviators. Thanks for the help. 1. Does your airport allow the above activities in leased facilities and T-hangars? 2. If not, how does your airport accommodate these activities? 3. Are you permitted to build your own T-Hangar or hangar? 4. What kind of fire protection do you have, where you work on your aircraft? 5. Does your airport require liability insurance, to be based there. 6. Does your airport require you to name the airport as an "Additional Insured" on your liability policy. 7. Does your airport require you to waive its liability as a condition to store your aircraft there? 8. Does your airport allow two owners to share a hangar? 9. How long does your airport permit a non-airworthy airplane on the airfield? --Kent Ashton, Cozy III flying, Mk IV building, BD-5 in the corner Concord, NC From: "Jim White" Subject: Re: COZY: Moving a Mark IV Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 20:52:58 -0700 I moved my Cozy IV using a Ryder car trailer. I could figure any way to fit it into their van. I did not tilt it, but I did place it at an angle on the trailer. As I recall, it was about 12 feet wide. In Washington and Oregon I was required to get a trip permit in each state and put a WIDE LOAD sign in 12" black letters on a yellow background on the front of the truck and on the back of the trailer. I also had red flags and bright yellow tape on the ends of the main strut. Running down the highway is no sweat, but driving in the big city made me a nervous wreck. Everything got to its final destination okay 310 miles later, but I will admit to kissing the ground when I got there. Good luck, Jim White N44QT "There are two ways to build a part; perfectly or over." -----Original Message----- From: Vance, John M. To: cozy_builders Date: Monday, August 02, 1999 8:41 AM Subject: COZY: Moving a Mark IV >Folks, > >I seem to remember a posting a while back talking about loading a >completed Cozy MIV into a Ryder type straight truck, but I have been >unsuccessful in finding it in the archives. > >If memory servers me correctly, it was stated that the plane would fit >by lowering the nose to one corner, and raising the strake on the >opposite side. Thus angling the main spar both horizontally and >fore/aft. > >If someone could confirm this, I would greatly appreciate it. > >Else, if someone could post the dimensions (width, thickness, length) >of the completed Mark IV spar/strake ends. > >John M. Vance >Cozy III project about to be replaced with Cozy IV from far away. > From: mister@neesnet.com Date: Thu, 05 Aug 1999 08:22:45 -0500 Subject: COZY: OshKosh Trip/COZY Comments Thought some of you builders might be interested in the following comments I sent to Nat: Hi Nat: My wife Mary and I were disappointed that we missed both the COZY forum and the dinner this year. We initially had planned on leaving Oshkosh on Saturday morning because of other committments. We were watching the weather quite closely and when the forecast started calling for thunderstorms friday night and saturday, we decided to depart on friday morning. We had a nice flight from OSH to Dunkirk NY where we stopped for fuel. My GPS was showing about 210 mph over the ground on that leg. We ran in to a line of large thunderstorms west of Dunkirk near Williamsport PA. We opted to land in Lockhaven PA and spend the night. It turned out to be a good decision and we enjoyed our stay. The Cozy III drew quite a bit of attention and we had several people waiting saturday morning to see us depart. Each time I make a long trip in the COZY I am thoroughly impressed with the comfort and performance of that little airplane. On the way out to OSH we cruised along smoothly and comfortably at 10,500 enjoying the natural air conditioning. Despite about a 50 mph headwind we went from just north of Providence RI to Saginaw MI (about 550 nm) in about 4 hrs 20 min. We stopped at Browne Field (3SG) in Saginaw to take advantage of their special OSHKOSH fuel price of $1.63 per gallon. We enjoyed chatting with you and Shirley . We spent quite a bit of time at our airplane talking to builders and potential builders. They seemed to appreciate it because with the canard planes parked out back in the north 40 as it were, there didn't seem to be too many pilots hanging out near there planes. Once again, thanks to you and Burt Rutan for such a capable and truly delightful traveling airplane. Hopefully we'll get to go to Sun n Fun next April. Best regards, Bob Misterka COZY N342RM www.gis.net/~bmist From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 18:58:15 -0500 (CDT) Subject: COZY: Canadian Authorization for US registered amatuer built aircraft Yesterday faxed Canada DOT for renewal of my permission to operate the Cosy in Canada. Wife got a phone call, no longer a fee, just carry some paperwork. Check As I understand download the "Standard Validation", carry it in the aircraft, and you are done. Caution: There is a paragraph, if the registered owner is operating, a written permission is required. Understand the US and Canada have finally come to agreement!!!! (The US was the bad guy) Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 18:35:45 -0400 From: dewayne morgan Subject: COZY: eating an elephant I just got my MK IV plans today and thought I would put my two cents worth in. I have been looking at kits since 1992 and have 95% completed a flightstar 2sl . This plane was a 150 hr build and i thought i would never get it done. Looking back,I guess now that i was just anxious. Anyway, I had been trying to justify a 2500 hour build time on this machine. Then a friend told me to treat it like you were eating an elephant (one bite at a time). The plans also say to do something every day no matter how small a task. I have studied nearly 550 aircraft and i believe this aircraft is pound per pound, dollar for dollar the best (by far ) aircraft offered on the market today. at first, I was sceptical of composite aircraft but that was due to my ignorance . Now , composites seem the only logical way to go . Now, I have a question. Will a 7x9 room be adequate (for now) for starting out? And what size room will i need for later? Also, a while back i saw a shematic/kit in an electronic magazine or maybe a kitplane/eaa magazine about a intercom kit that you could build yourself. If anyone remembers this article please let me know. thanks dewayne From: "John Slade" Subject: Re: COZY: eating an elephant Date: Wed, 8 Sep 1999 21:26:52 -0400 Hello DeWayne, Welcome to the world of Cozy building. >treat it like you were eating an elephant (one bite at a time). Hmm. I suspect elephant hide might be a bit tough. Perhaps a small herd of cattle would be a better analogy. >The plans also say to do something every day no matter how small a task. Absolutely. This is good advice. Of course - the bigger the bite the more the progress and ten half hour building sessions will get you about half as far as one 5 hour session. Continuity is a big factor. >this aircraft is pound per pound, dollar for dollar the best (by far ) You wont find many to argue with you in this mailgroup. >Now, I have a question. Will a 7x9 room be adequate (for now) for >starting out? You won't get far in a room that size. I guess you could do chapter 4 (bulkheads) but then you'd outgrow it. Plans call for a workbench roughly 11 * 4 and you DO need it. Tis said that you can get by in a single garage for a while, then later you'll need a double garage. I have a 40 * 20 covered patio which does the job nicely. One builder I know bought himself one of those big (30 * 15 I think) dome buildings, Central Heat and Air and everything. (Jerry - are you there? - how's it going?) >Also, a while back i saw a shematic/kit in an electronic magazine or >maybe a kitplane/eaa magazine about a intercom kit that you could build >yourself. If anyone remembers this article please let me know. You might wish to take a look at my progress web site chapter 22 http://www.kgarden.com/cozy/chap22.htm which details my experience building an intercom / audio panel / marker beacon kit from RST http://rst-engr.com/ ). I didnt see the article, but I suspect that Jim Weir from RST is probably the author. He writes a column in Sport Aviation. Good luck John Slade Cozy Mk IV #757 (Glassing the elevators) http://kgarden.com/cozy Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 08:13:03 -0500 From: David Domeier Subject: Re: COZY: eating an elephant dewayne, It took me about 6 years to eat the elephant, but I eat slowly. Some guys get it done much sooner. The weather had a lot to do with it. I found it was a waste of time to lay up glass in 60° temperatures, and about half the year it is such or less around here. To heat a shop really runs up the cost. And besides, it is important to keep things in perspective - building an airplane in a short time may not be worth some other things in life...like a marriage and a social exchange now and then. A most frequent comment I get concerning building time is, "....six years! Wow! That's too long for me.", to which I respond, "...it was a commitment to have some fun and not a scheduled event. The six years is going to pass whether you build an airplane or not, why not do it and have a very fine flying machine rather than wish the rest of your life you had done it.." So many people say they have been thinking about it all their lives. re "Now, I have a question. Will a 7x9 room be adequate (for now) for starting out? And what size room will i need for later?" It will be some kind of challenge to build the MKIV in a 7x9 room, but you surely can get started. Many jigs and parts can be built in that space. I'd guess you can spend 1000 hours in that little cube if you want to. You won't need anywhere near that much room to build one of RST's intercom systems. I say get started and never look back. You won't regret it. dd MKIV N10CZ (99.6 on the hobbs and all is very well...) From: Militch@aol.com Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 10:24:28 EDT Subject: Re: Re: COZY: eating an elephant I almost decided to build a Varieze back in 1983, but didn't because it was going to take too long. Last year it occurred to me that if I had started then, I would have already been flying it for several years. So now I am building a Cozy Mark IV. It might take 10 years, but like someone else said, those ten years will pass whether I am building or not. And, as it turns out, it's a lot of fun, so the time doesn't matter all that much anyway (at least as far as I am concerned). Regards From: "Romulo Augusto" Subject: Re: COZY: eating an elephant Date: Thu, 9 Sep 1999 11:24:15 -0300 David Domeier wrote: > dewayne, > > It took me about 6 years to eat the elephant, but I eat slowly. > Some guys get it done much sooner. > My two Real Cents worth: In experimental aviation, no pleasure, no gain. If you have time a lot to build your Cozy, let's build it. If you haven't [like me], let's build it, too. Fast or slow is not so important. The pleasure what you will take from the build act is one of the rewards. Don't allow the schedule take it out from you. Just build..... Regards. ________________________________________________________ Romulo Augusto da Cruz, Jr, Ten.Méd. , Cozy #0730 ( in chapter 5/6, yet!) Rua da Bahia 1345/sala1103 Lourdes Belo Horizonte, MG Fones: 55-31-274-5667, 55-31-9948-2075, 55-31-497-2080 http://www.geocities.com/capecanaveral/hall/3186 Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 08:07:07 -0400 From: "L. Wayne Hicks" Subject: COZY: Re: [c-a] Sale prices for completed Cozy/Cosy aircraft BCGARDNER@aol.com wrote: has anyone seen prices for completed Cozy four-place or > three-place airplanes? I'm wondering what they are worth or will be > worth? > > Maybe the real problem is that once completed, no one wants to sell them > ;^) -----------> Go look at http://www.canard.com and at the SoCal EZ Squadron site (I don't have the URL at the moment...) You'll find the Cozy IV's selling in the mid $60,000's. Another Cozy IV builder was offered $75,000 for his at Sun N Fun. People usually keep their birds not only because they like what they build, but I suspect because the Cozy IV is an economical bird to build and fly, it's fast and fun, and a good investment when it is time to sell. Wayne Hicks Cozy IV #678 Chapter 18 http://www.geocities.com/yosemite/falls/2027 Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 12:00:35 -0500 From: David Domeier Subject: COZY: Enough Liability Issues - LETS FLY!! John, re " I wish these issues would be discussed in some legal forum somewhere. Does anyone have anything to say about actually building and flying these wonderful airplanes?" I agree. We could easily worry ourselves to death ......and miss out on a lot of good flying....let's be cautious and press on. My hobbs turned 101.0 yesterday after a flight check on the cabin heat system. It hadn't been putting out much heat and with winter coming it needed fixing. In checking everything, I discovered the door which directs hot air to the carb intake for anti ice did not seat tightly against the hot air intake hole when heat was off. I was actually getting cold ram air past the door to the cabin. After installing some red baffle material on the top of the door, it now seats very tightly against the carb heat intake, and guess what, I have VERY hot air coming forward. With the cabin heat valve full on, I would estimate the air at about 120° coming forward. It is hot! There is a slight hot odor but the CO detector has not changed color from bright yellow. Another issue - GPS antenna location. I have found that the antenna attached to my Lowrance 300 loses signal quite easily in a turn. The antenna can be detached so at present I have it duct taped to the under side of the panel forward of the canard. It works very well in that location. Paint, primer, and a half inch of foam does not seem to degrade the signal at all. In fact the system has been finding itself on start much quicker than before. I am using a fuel flow indication to set power vrs rpm. This assumes a BSFC of .435 for the 0360 and leaning to peak egt. 75% = 9.8 gph 65% = 8.5 gph 50% = 6.5 gph and 45% = 5.9 gph. On take off it should read 13.1 gph but I am actually burning about 14.5, so there's much cooling fuel at full throttle. Considering the engine is probably developing only 150 HP at 2380 rpm on take off, the full rich mixture providing 14.5 gph is very conservative re cooling. I've had to adjust the wing incidence again to fine tune straight and level flight. I figured out a way of installing washers with a mixing stick, masking tape and a 1/2 inch slot in the stick without removing the bolt entirely. One of these days I'll have to refinish the wing/strake joint. But that's purely cosmetic stuff. I hate to ground the airplane for any length of time...it is a fun machine to fly and I do try to get up 3 or 4 times a week. If anyone is interested here is a Cozy MKIV checklist -- (it works for me) COZY MKIV CHECKLIST EXTERIOR PREFLIGHT FUEL SELECTOR-ON FUEL AND OIL QUANTITY-CHECK FUEL SUMP-DRAIN PROP CONDITION-CHECK TIRES-CHECK FLIGHT CONTROLS-CHECK SPEED BRAKE UP BEFORE START ELECTRIC FUEL PUMP-CHECK GPS-ON NOSE GEAR-FULL DOWN AFTER START OIL PRESSURE-CHECK ENGINE FUEL PUMP-CHECK ATIS BEFORE TAKE OFF MAG/DIS-CHECK FUEL VALVE-CHECK FUEL PUMP-ON NAV/STROBE LIGHTS-ON TRANSPONDER-ON CANOPY-LOCKED AFTER TAKE OFF FUEL PUMP-OFF CRUISE FUEL-CHECK BEFORE LANDING FUEL PUMP-ON MIXTURE-AS REQRD GEAR-DOWN AFTER LANDING SPEED BRAKE-UP TRANSPONDER-OFF dd From: "Rick Maddy" Subject: COZY: A brief intro Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 15:29:26 -0600 I want to introduce myself as the proud new owner of Cozy Mark IV plans #0824, better known to my friends and family as Rick Maddy. I was working at home for a change, trying to meet tomorrow's deadline, when the door bell rang. It's the mailman (mailwomen actually). Uh Oh! She has my Cozy plans. I just called Nat Saturday to order them. This is bad. How am I going to get any work done now!? A brief intro to myself: I got my private license about four weeks ago out of Centennial (APA) near Denver, CO. I am planning on getting my IFR rating next year followed by a Mountain sign-off. Eventually I may get a commercial rating but no rush. I figure I will be working on the Cozy for several years. I spend the bulk of the week working as a software engineer. This will be my first homebuilt if you don't count a plans built R/C airplane I built about 10 years ago. That only took 100 hours. I destroyed that on its third flight by getting into a diving spiral I didn't know how to get out of. Slammed the poor plane into the trees at full throttle. I still can hear the horrible sound of balsa and tree limbs snapping. I figure that's out of my system so I don't expect anything even remotely close to that happening with a real plane :) OK, now what? I have a letter, two books of instructions, a stack of diagrams, and a big stack of newsletters. Unfortunately I have some time before I can begin any building on the plane. I don't have a workshop yet. My wife Shelly and I are going to fix up our old, single car, detached garage. It's actually more barn like. It's a mess. Full of crap we don't want, full of dirt I don't want, full of holes I don't want, and no lighting or heat. It's only 18' by 15' so I know I can't build the whole plane in there. I realize I can probably work in this for a few years before it is a real issue (I have a real job that will take up most of my week). The garage is actually two levels. We are planning on getting rid of everything inside, cleaning it up, insulating, drywalling, and painting it. Of course we will add lighting. It actually has two, 30amp circuits running to it so power wont be problem. My biggest concern is dirt and dust. The big garage door opens to an alley. There is a bit of traffic here and it kicks up a lot of fine dirt and dust. I realize working with fiberglass requires a clean workshop. Hopefully I can get the garage sealed up well. Anyway my first real question is what can I do in my spare time with the plans? I believe I can go through all the newsletters and mark up the changes. I guess I can make notes from the FAQ on the Unofficial Cozy Home Page. Anything else? Oops, not too brief like the subject says. Keeps the great info flowing. Thanks Rick Maddy (cozy@maddyhome.com) Cozy Mk IV #0824: Pre-build Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:19:14 -0400 From: "L. Wayne Hicks" Subject: Re: COZY: A brief intro Rick Maddy wrote: Shelly and I are going to fix up our old, single car, detached > garage. It's only 18' by 15'. My biggest concern is dirt and dust. -------> Plenty big enough for the first few years. The biggest source of dust will be from the plane itself. When doing fiberglass layups, you only need to vacuum the parts being glassed, ensure you keep your cloth clean and keep the dust out of your pumps. Of course, it helps to keep the shop clean so that the dust doesn't blow around, but the shop doesn't need to be a 10K NASA cleanroom. > Anyway my first real question is what can I do in my spare time with the > plans? --------> Put them under your pillow along with a buck. Who knows, maybe the Cozy fairy will save you all that building time! (Ha, Ha!) It didn't work for me.... Welcome to the group. Wayne Hicks Cozy IV #678 Chapter 18 http://www.geocities.com/yosemite/falls/2027 From: "John Slade" Subject: Re: COZY: A brief intro Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:44:31 -0400 Welcome, Rick >R/C airplane - destroyed on its third flight Happened to me too. There's something weird about flying towards yourself. Mine landed INSIDE an ice cream vendor's truck. Oops, sorrrrrrry! >My biggest concern is dirt and dust. The >big garage door opens to an alley. There is a bit of traffic here and it >kicks up a lot of fine dirt and dust. I realize working with fiberglass >requires a clean workshop. My project is outside on the patio. We have a dirt road in front of our house. Its really not a problem. I keep my raw materials covered with dust cloths and I vacuum the foam (per plans) before each layup. >Anyway my first real question is what can I do in my spare time with the >plans? IMHO - 1. read the plans, study the drawings 2. go through all the newsletters and mark up the changes. 3. make notes from the FAQ and the archives 4. call Wicks, order Chapters 4 - 7 and misc stuff and MGS epoxy. Cost around $2500. 5. dive in and make stuff. Do your layups in the bathroom if you have to, but get started! 6. read builder's web sites 7. read the plans, study the drawings If you're cramped on space you can still do a lot of time consuming work - like making all the bulkheads, seats, armrests, aluminum parts and every template and jig for the plane. I say MGS because its odorless - better if you're working in the house. I know one guy who is building in a small apartment. His fuselage is right by his bed. The more the project is "in your face" or even "in your way" the more you'll get on with it. Put it in a hanger and visit with other builders every saturday for hanger talk and you'll take 10 years. Bottom line - get started and do something on the plane every day. You'll be amazed at how things start to come together. Good luck, John Slade http://kgarden.com/cozy From: "John Slade" Subject: Re: COZY: A brief intro Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:56:31 -0400 Rick, >I want to introduce myself as the proud new owner of Cozy Mark IV plans #0824 When you start out it seems overwhelming. I bought plans # 757 in March '99. I've completed the fuselage, canard, elevators, gear, spar and most of the fairings. Just started on the wings. At this rate the airframe will be done in less than a year. Just wanted to give some perspective. John Slade From: "John Slade" Subject: Re: COZY: A brief intro Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 19:10:46 -0400 >maybe the Cozy fairy will save you all that building time! The Cozy fairy. Who's the Cozy fairy? Am I missing something good? :) From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 19:39:17 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: COZY: A brief intro was said May that be the worst that happens to EVERYONE Recently had a close friend lose control of a RV-8 while hi-speed taxiing. Hit a runway light, VASI, hurry up get out, hit the master switch on with fuel pump on, and a broken fuel line. He got out with no injuries, plane burnt to the ground. He never experienced first flight, considerable $$$ and building time lost. Sounded like there wasn't sufficient rudder, pilot inexperience with tailwheel. Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 08:03:40 -0400 From: Paul Krasa Subject: Re: COZY: A brief intro Read, Read, Read, Read. The more time you spend now understanding the plans the less time you will have to read the plans later. Down load all the Cozy Archives, and read, read, read. Order all the Central States Association news letters, and read some more. What will eventually happen is a picture will form in your mind of the airplane you are going to build. Each homebuilt airplane is unique because of the customization the builder chooses to incorporate into the airplane. The customization is not so much a deviation from plans, but an adding of features. An example is which cockpit heating system will be used? From airplane to airplane this varies from none to a forced air system using a oil cooler in the nose. Once the picture of the airplane forms in your mind, make a plan. The first part of your plan has already formed: clean and refurbish the garage. This is a common first step. Your garage will last alot longer as a workshop if you plan for storage of the big items. Where will you store the wings and canard while you are working on the fuselage, and visa versa? If you put them in your workspace, this could be a problem. If you have a pull down stair leading to your attic, then this is a great storage area for raw materials and finished parts. A side benefit is composite parts get post cured in the attic during the summer because of the elevated temperatures. When will you work on your project? In truth this is the most important variable to the successful completion of the project. Be brutally honest with yourself. To complete the project you and your family will need to dedicate a significant amount of your time to building an airplane. It takes an average of four to five years of high dedication to finish an airplane from start to finish. I worked on my project at least one hour per week night, and Saturdays. Building an airplane is a process. If you take time to plan now, it will go alot more smoothly. Get your family involed now in the planning process. Brainstorm everything. Money, time, storage, make or buy decisions, etc. Sit down with your family and make these decisions together because in most cases when you need that help at 10:30 at night when a layup is taking to long or some other thing occurs it will be your family who is available to bail you out. More projects fail because a builder forgets to take the family into consideration. Oh and did I say as part of your project budgets to budget more money for flowers, and other nice presents for your spouse. After your spouse has bailed you out and it is now 1:30am and she has to work the next morning, you better send flowers to her work as a way to say thanks. VERY IMPORTANT!! Do not neglect your spouse if you want your marrige to survive the building of an airplane. Well this is getting kind of long an I am sure the other "experts" will chime in. Paul Long EZ 214LP > >Anyway my first real question is what can I do in my spare time with the >plans? I believe I can go through all the newsletters and mark up the >changes. I guess I can make notes from the FAQ on the Unofficial Cozy Home >Page. Anything else? > >Oops, not too brief like the subject says. Keeps the great info flowing. > >Thanks > >Rick Maddy (cozy@maddyhome.com) >Cozy Mk IV #0824: Pre-build > > > Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 09:13:30 -0400 From: Phillip Subject: COZY: A brief intro -------------Forwarded Message----------------- From: Phillip, 75202.370 To: "Rick Maddy", INTERNET:cozy@maddyhome.com Date: 9/29/99 9:01 AM RE: COZY: A brief intro Rick, When I first got my plans, I used my spare time to hand trace all the bulkhead drawings. I didn't want to use the originals for the purpose of making my bulkheads. Some people photo copied these drawings, but if you do that, you need to be sure that the reproduction is 1 to 1. I used a big glass window and taped my original to the glass and then taped a blank piece of paper over the original and hand traced it. I then cut the bulkhead drawings out with scissors. This system worked great with me and I was very satisfied with how the bulkheads turned out. Good luck,, Phillip Sill, #707 Chapter 6 From: Muzzy Norman E Subject: RE: COZY: A brief intro Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 08:51:43 -0500 >>maybe the Cozy fairy will save you all that building time! The Cozy fairy. Who's the Cozy fairy? Am I missing something good? :)>> A dollar under the pillow beats that business of having to sacrifice goats... I am in the process of waiting for the truckload of supplies. My experience so far- Work through the list of what should I do different such that you can come to the realization that if you change everything you will build nothing. Pick your battles carefully, there is sufficient challenge in the number of hours required to build without trying to start from scratch. Order your materials early. My gameplan- Order all of the foam and cloth up front. The archives are full of stories of people running short on cloth at the end of the chapter. My initial order is for all of the materials except for the wheels and brakes, fuel system components, electrical, some of the later stuff. The bulk of the cost is in the foam, the cloth, and the resin. I ordered full rolls of cloth to avoid handling damage, wrinkles, and such. The truck freight for everything looks to be under $200, so I am putting everything on the truck that I can think of. Try to minimize shipping costs. There will be plenty of little stuff to keep the UPS guy busy as it is. My initial plan was to buy the supplies at Oshkosh to take advantage of the 10% discount. My order was not 100% fleshed out yet. In discussions with Wicks they pointed out that the ad in Kit Planes every month says 'mention this ad and save 10%'. So make sure you do that (if you buy from Wicks). I placed my order the 10th of September. Some of the foam that is needed early on will not be in until the 20th of October. And they were out of full rolls of BID. Sigh... But once the truckload of materials arrives, there will be no waiting for the truck. I have plenty of stuff outside of plane building to stay busy with. Fuse jigs are built, canard templates cut out, making the metal parts, still need to see if I can borrow a temporary firewall... Do the practice layups. Many times. Learn what the difference is between 70 degree epoxy, 80 degree epoxy, and 90 degree epoxy. It is amazing. I will be working in a very warm shop! I did some of the layups with a scale, and then bought a pump. In my opinion, the only way to fly. Understand how to check calibration on your pump. Find another composite builder in your area. Try their pump if you want the experience before laying out the money. You may find a used pump to buy or borrow. Find other builders. Arrange to borrow all of the jigs, templates, and expertise that is available. I have experts volunteered to help with the hotwiring. We will have a hotwire party once the foam is here. Set up all of the foam ahead of time, and in one fell swoop wire the wings, canard, winglets. I have been hotwiring RC boat hulls for my sun. It is fun stuff! I could do this all by my lonesome, but why not lean on the people who have some experience in the area? Qualify your experts carefully. The most outspoken may not know what they are talking about. Look at the finished projects, the quality of the work, and choose carefully who you listen to. There is a lot of good suggestions available, but there are a lot of opinions floating around also. Just like my opinions in this posting... Understand where Nat is coming from and why. He cannot 'approve' design changes that are thrown at him almost continuously from many different directions. Talk to someone who is flying a plane, get their take on how to build. My collections- build it by the plans and you will save yourself a lot of trouble. There are some 'tricks of the trade' that are learned first (or second or third) time through, this gets back to leaning on experts. From: alwick@juno.com Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 23:52:10 -0700 Subject: Re: COZY: A brief intro On Tue, 28 Sep 1999 15:29:26 -0600 "Rick Maddy" writes: > > This will be my first homebuilt if you don't count a plans built R/C > airplane I built about 10 years ago. Welcome Rick. I've got 23 rc planes ... most are intact. My favorite crash: My wife made the kids go to the car when she realized that the pilot wasn't quite in command. A few minutes later, while the kids were wrestling in the car, it got hit dead center. Never could get that dent outa the top of the car. Only took 8 hrs to repair the plane. I agree with others comments. Just get started. The plans are superb. Particularly the first chapters. -al wick Canopy Latch System guy. Artificial intelligence in Cockpit Cozy sn 389 driven by stock Subaru 2.5 ltr 103% complete, Aug 00 first flight sched.. ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. From: gmellen@juno.com Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 11:07:34 -0400 Subject: Re: COZY: A brief intro >When you start out it seems overwhelming. I bought plans # 757 in >March '99. >I've completed the fuselage, canard, elevators, gear, spar and most of >the >fairings. Just started on the wings. At this rate the airframe will >be done >in less than a year. John, Your NOT married with children are you? I have about 1200 Hrs. of build time in 7 years on my 3 place Cozy! Still plugging away. George Mellen gmellen@juno.com ___________________________________________________________________ Get the Internet just the way you want it. Free software, free e-mail, and free Internet access for a month! Try Juno Web: http://dl.www.juno.com/dynoget/tagj. From: "John Slade" Subject: Re: COZY: A brief intro Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 11:41:33 -0400 George, >Your NOT married with children are you? Hmmm. That's a much more complex question than you might think. The simple answer is yes. If you ask "do I have a life outside of the airplane?" the answer is a definate yes. >I have about 1200 Hrs. of build time in 7 years on my 3 place Cozy! >Still plugging away. I think my build time so far is roughly 760, i.e. around 100 hrs / month as compared with your 8. I think the main trick is continuity. John Slade Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 22:32:55 -0400 From: Brian Freitag Subject: COZY: Brief Intro Hello Rick, Ok This is what I would do if I was in your situation, I am only giving my opion and I hope I dont get some people upset........But sometimes it is wise to help others then help yourself and at the sametime if you can help yourself thats a bonus. So now that is said.........if you can afford to do it you should look at the projects for sale adds in the latest news letter and you will see you can get a great deal at the price of someone elses sweat, I have talked to a few people that have said..(.and I quote) if I had to do it all over again I would buy a project allready in progress. and you will be so far ahead of the game you will be happy you did it. But take someone with you who knows what there looking at. Just my opion Brian #094 Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 11:35:42 -0500 From: Ken Reiter Subject: COZY: Low Time Builders Hi Group, Just to pump everybody UP! It took (ME) over 10 years, yes that's right 10 years to complete my CozyIII. (IT DOES NOT HAVE TO TAKE THIS LONG - IT JUST TOOK ME THAT LONG!) Regrets: - There are now four of us and only three seats - took ME to long to build However, I still get a smile whenever I think about the plane and the fun it gives me as well as the fun for our kid's friends when we take them for rides. (Have yet to have a parent say no. As a matter of fact, the darn ride list keeps getting longer no shorter.) Started the project before I had the Priv ticket and did the first flight with the GREAT help of Vance and Ken, total time for me was only 93 total hours in Cessna 150 and 1 in a Bonanza. The best help was the 1 hour in the Bonanza, because it gets you to realize that each plane flys a little different - just like the master, Nat, states in the manual. Guys, do not give up and no matter how long it take it is worth it! You too will soon enjoy flying in your our aircraft. Keep building, Ken From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 22:24:27 -0500 (CDT) Subject: COZY: Aircraft des Below is from DTC DUATS this evening, of the acceptable aircraft designators for the Rutan based family. I had entered ?RUTAN. If entering Cosy, or Cozy, the 3rd line is output. Cosy, Classic and Aerocad were not accepted as invalid. I understand these are for air traffic control purposes, and the list is maintained by the ATC people. Main purpose is to define performance for controllers. Much more descriptive than "HXB/U". It wouldn't surprise me that other arms of the F.A.A. lump according these designators. **** Current Time: Thu Sep 30 03:07 (UTC) **** DESIG MODEL NAME MANUFACTURER ARES 151 ARES RUTAN BOOM 202 BOOMERANG RUTAN COZY COZY, CLASSIC CO-Z, RUTAN, COSY DEFI 40 DEFIANT RUTAN LGEZ 61 LONG-EZ RUTAN SOLI 77 SOLITAIRE RUTAN VEZE 33 VARIEZE RUTAN VVIG 27, 32 VARIVIGGEN RUTAN From: LMAndrasi@aol.com Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 20:55:16 EDT Subject: COZY: Cozy III vs CozyIV Hello, I was just about to order the Cozy IV plans when I ran across a good deal on a set of Cozy III plans. They are complete and unused. I only need a two place with good baggage and the III looks as if it would serve my purposes. Can someone explain the differences to me? I'm a newbie and I don't want to make a mistake. I would appreciate any help I can get. Thank you, Bryon From: cdenk@ix.netcom.com Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 20:29:38 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Re: COZY: Cozy III vs CozyIV Before buying a set of plans, check with Nat to ensure they are genuine, there are more than a few copied sets out there. The important if there are only 2 of you, is a roomier front seat which is 3.5" wider, and there is more luggage room. My Cosy Classic has the wider front seat, but the 3 place rear seat, and we frequently pack it full with 2 backpacks tent, etc. and almost wish for more space. The wider also is the instrument panel which helps especially if if going to IFR equip. The $500 cost of the plans is such a small part (1%) of the total cost, if ever sell, will be much more valuable, and otherwise literally no difference in cost or building time. From: "John Slade" Subject: Re: COZY: Cozy III vs CozyIV Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 21:58:17 -0400 Hello Byron, Given the time, effort and money you're going to put into building I'd have thought you'd be much better off with the Cozy IV. 1. Its the newer model. One evolved into the other. Resale value of the project [should you give up] and/or the finished airplane will be higher with the IV. 2. If you buy plans you'll be able to go direct to the designer for support and you'll get updates / corrections. This has a definate value. 3. You're needs might change during the building process. Its easy to leave space unused. Its hard to add more space. 4. There are many prefab molded fiberglass parts available for the IV which (correct me if I'm wrong, AeroCad & Featherlite guys) are not available for the III. [wings, canard, spar, etc. etc.] You might decide half way through to spend some cash and save yourself a LOT of time. You won't have that option with the III. I think any one of the above would outweigh the savings of a few hundred $ on a dated set of plans. Just my opinion. I could be wrong. regards, John Slade